View Full Version : Weekend/fun car
Let's get back to waffling.
Just pick one. No commuting, just errands, fun drives, nights out, etc.
John V
12-11-2008, 09:52 AM
986S
/thread
987S
/thread
Right. It's between the Elise and the 987S, but since one of the things you'd do with it is "nights out," the 987S walks it. Can you imagine ushering your bride in skirt and heels into the cabin of the Elise for a relaxing drive to a restaurant for date night? Especially with the top on? This would happen, in my house anyway, exactly once.
Just noticed the poll...
Isn't an '05 997S still way more $$ than an '07 987S?
Right. It's between the Elise and the 987S, but since one of the things you'd do with it is "nights out," the 987S walks it. Can you imagine ushering your bride in skirt and heels into the cabin of the Elise for a relaxing drive to a restaurant for date night? Especially with the top on? This would happen, in my house anyway, exactly once.
Yeah, I figured. My wife already hates the Elise. I could still get it and obviously not use it for going out, but then I'm cutting down on the few times I could use such a car.
Funny that so far everyone digs the 987S over the CS.
Just noticed the poll...
Isn't an '05 997S still way more $$ than an '07 987S?
Yes, it is.
Yeah, I figured. My wife already hates the Elise. I could still get it and obviously not use it for going out, but then I'm cutting down on the few times I could use such a car.
Funny that so far everyone digs the 987S over the CS.
I've never driven the Cayman, but since the Boxster is cheaper and has a top that goes down, it's the obvious choice for me for the kinds of things that you are considering doing with it. Now, if you were going to do track days, maybe the Cayman, but I'd give up a touch of torsional rigidity for the ability to put the top down.
Yeah, I figured. My wife already hates the Elise. I could still get it and obviously not use it for going out, but then I'm cutting down on the few times I could use such a car.
Funny that so far everyone digs the 987S over the CS.
I do dig this. But for the role you describe, the Boxster S is a better fit.
http://www.autotrader.com/dealers/dda/detail.jsp?ct=u&result_car_id=null&dealership_view_name=bathesdajaguar&car_id=246629920&dealer_id=277086
I do dig this. But for the role you describe, the Boxster S is a better fit.
http://www.autotrader.com/dealers/dda/detail.jsp?ct=u&result_car_id=null&dealership_view_name=bathesdajaguar&car_id=246629920&dealer_id=277086
I saw that. Yesterday, actually.
I just wonder if I'll get sick of the convertible. And if I do get the jeep wrangler, that would already be a convertible. I dunno.
As far as cost, the 987S seems to go for as much as the Cayman. The coupes seem to take a bigger depreciation hit.
I've never driven the Cayman, but since the Boxster is cheaper and has a top that goes down, it's the obvious choice for me for the kinds of things that you are considering doing with it. Now, if you were going to do track days, maybe the Cayman, but I'd give up a touch of torsional rigidity for the ability to put the top down.
That's exactly the thought I had when I went to the dealers in the summer of 06. I thought it was overpriced and after an initial almost purchase of a 3.2L 987S, was only shopping for 3.4L 987S and 997's. It took one drive to open my eyes and two drives to convince. I didn't care about paper specs and still don't. The look and especially the feel of the thing did it for me. And believe me they do feel different.
Of course there are 'vert people and hardtop people. But one of the better salesmen, said to me during a back-to-back BoxS/CayS waffling test drive: "It's obvious which you should pick." And it really was. Either way, I think both 'vert and hardtop people ought to at least drive both.
Another point is the fantastic value on offer with caymans. Especially now that 06/07 S's have taken a huge hit, even low mileage ones with 3 yrs of warranty for low 40's. It feels like nothing else, and the update is not such a biggie. See, e.g., motive magazine's review of the 09. In summary, extra hp not really noticeable, steering feel very good, but a bit diluted. And of course 25-30k more! It is well-built, feels and goes like a benchmark. If you happen to need some extra juice, you can get it to 330hp-ish for about 3k. Sounds awesome etc. etc. In fact, after the breast cancer drive, I'm over my 135i fling as well, the cayman is the only car that doesn't get old for me. It's good in the way classic porsches are good, only better, almost new and basically for the same cost.
Now how many times can I vote on this poll? ;)
Right. It's between the Elise and the 987S, but since one of the things you'd do with it is "nights out," the 987S walks it. Can you imagine ushering your bride in skirt and heels into the cabin of the Elise for a relaxing drive to a restaurant for date night? Especially with the top on? This would happen, in my house anyway, exactly once.
Meh, unless she's tubby there's not really a problem.
I've driven both. lemming was with me when I drove the Cayman. But the test drives were sooo far apart I just remember loving both. Although the Cayman felt almost as fast as the 996C2. Also, the 987S I drove was a 3.2L.
No question I'll drive both more thoroughly when the time comes.
Another point is the fantastic value on offer with caymans. Especially now that 06/07 S's have taken a huge hit, even low mileage ones with 3 yrs of warranty for low 40's.
They have taken a huge hit recently. I expect that in 10-15 months a clean '06-'07 CS will be $40K or under.
That time is basically now. I don't think I could sell mine (06CS, 15k miles, low options, excellent condition) for that. I'd want 42 but I don't think I'd get a bid above 40. Anyway, it's not for sale.
Since the Boxster is cheaper and has a top that goes down, it's the obvious choice for me for the kinds of things that you are considering doing with it. Now, if you were going to do track days, maybe the Cayman, but I'd give up a touch of torsional rigidity for the ability to put the top down.
Exactly
That time is basically now. I don't think I could sell mine (06CS, 15k miles, low options, excellent condition) for that. I'd want 42 but I don't think I'd get a bid above 40. Anyway, it's not for sale.
Great, I won't mind paying $35K either.;)
Theo, it's all paper & armchair until you get out and properly drive.
It's all paper & armchair until you get out and properly drive.
Of course. But I've driven them enough to know I want one or the other.
Hmmm, there's a lot of love for the 986S. ;)
From the looks of the poll, it looks like someone might have some pull with one of the admins...
ROFL
John V
12-11-2008, 11:22 AM
I actually had nothing to do with that, but it's funny. ;)
Honestly, having driven the 987 (Boxster, not Cayman), it's an awesome car. Awesome. I love it. And yes, I am a very biased party in this discussion.
But for a weekend fun car... I just don't think the improvements are worth twice the price of a mint 986S. Nevermind the fact that if you hate it, you're at the bottom of the depreciation curve and you can get out of it for about what you're into it. The 987 cars are nowhere near the bottom of the depreciation curve.
Unless of course you're wealthy and cost is no object. In which case, get the 987S. :)
clyde
12-11-2008, 11:24 AM
no comment
986S wasn't on the poll. But I'd certainly put it above the Elise for FC's purposes. And the fun/value proposition is next to unbeatable, mellow, tuneful engine, fun times. For someone unsure, it would be good. Perhaps a boxster/cayman wasn't what he needed/wanted after all, and he'd find out for not much cost.
But FC has some high standards, he didn't even list the 05-06 BoxS or the 997 base, both of which are very nice cars.
One last thing... I don't know what it portends for the 987.2 (the motive mag review said sound was intact, even better) but the 997.2 sound was even less porsche-like and quieter. And I always found the 997 too quiet to begin with.
no comment
:twisted:
Hey, if JV holds on to his car until late summer (at the earliest), then I'll buy it.
As equ points out, JV's car is the perfect "let's find out" car.
Theo, it's all paper & armchair until you get out and properly drive.
Have not driven the 987S but I have driven the 986S.
Its more to do with the option of having the top down experiance as JST has said and not as much the handling difference in the two.
I don't even know what most of those numbers mean. I suppose that's ok though. I don't really care about the parkin glot modifications that the P crowd obsesses over either.
I would pick a boxter if a two seater were possible. I don't like the convertible aspect, but my wife would.
Sharp11
12-11-2008, 12:17 PM
Eh, that list list is not nearly diverse enough ...... too many good choices not present, nor even considered.
Ed
lupinsea
12-11-2008, 12:55 PM
I should have read through the tread before voting.
Can anyone change my vote from the 987S to the 986S?
Basically: I'd suggest a Boxster over the Elise because of the difficulty getting in and out of the Elise. Sure, it's a phenomonal car for what it is and I lusted after one for a long time, but after actually sitting in the car I knew something like that would annoy me very quickly. Especially if you're planning to use this car as a night-out car with your wife or something.
Then. Between the two Boxsters it just started making sense to get the older one that's at the low point of it's depreciation. Lower initial cost. But didn't you post something about a problem with a wee too much flex in the crankshaft causing problems necessitating engine replacement? Something like that.
I don't doubt the Cayman would offer even higher levels of driver goodness than the open topped Boxsters . . . but there's something about a drop top that's just very enjoyable. And if it's going to be a weekend car, why not?
For all their legendary status, the 911s have just never appealed to me much.
So that's my rational for your poll list. If those are really the cars your focusing on.
However, I'd agree with Ed that there are a bunch of other fun cars that aren't on your list that may be worth a drive.
clyde
12-11-2008, 01:21 PM
:twisted:
Hey, if JV holds on to his car until late summer (at the earliest), then I'll buy it.
As equ points out, JV's car is the perfect "let's find out" car.
Damn, man, your user title sure is getting wordy. :p
John V
12-11-2008, 01:29 PM
Having driven various 996 911s (and zero 997 911s) I just don't find them appealing. Fast in a straight line, yes. Wonderful steering feel, yes. But they're ponderous. Reluctant. Now, a GT3 or a GT2 would be a different proposition entirely... :drool:
All the M96 engines (any non turbo non GT2-3 996/986) have potential for issues with the IMS (intermediate shaft) and the RMS (rear main seal). The RMS issue is one that typically happens within the first few years / miles of ownership. If it hasn't happened by 30-40,000 miles, it almost never happens. The IMS is a roll of the dice. It seems to happen more in the later model year 986 cars ('03-'04) and very early in their life, but there isn't enough data to draw conclusions.
For a weekend / fun car, I think a convertible is the way to go. My opinion. I drove my car to work yesterday because it was so warm and I felt bad for letting it sit for so long. It really is a brilliant car. My SO is looking for a new job, one where she won't have to have a four-door car, and she really loves the Boxster. I am really hoping we are able to keep it, because if I sell it I know I will never again find one as nice as the one I have. At the same time, I would like to have the money to invest.
Damn, man, your user title sure is getting wordy. :p
:lol:
Now, the question is... does user title #1 explain user title #2?
Having driven various 996 911s (and zero 997 911s) I just don't find them appealing. Fast in a straight line, yes. Wonderful steering feel, yes. But they're ponderous. Reluctant. Now, a GT3 or a GT2 would be a different proposition entirely... :drool:
All the M96 engines (any non turbo non GT2-3 996/986) have potential for issues with the IMS (intermediate shaft) and the RMS (rear main seal). The RMS issue is one that typically happens within the first few years / miles of ownership. If it hasn't happened by 30-40,000 miles, it almost never happens. The IMS is a roll of the dice. It seems to happen more in the later model year 986 cars ('03-'04) and very early in their life, but there isn't enough data to draw conclusions.
For a weekend / fun car, I think a convertible is the way to go. My opinion. I drove my car to work yesterday because it was so warm and I felt bad for letting it sit for so long. It really is a brilliant car. My SO is looking for a new job, one where she won't have to have a four-door car, and she really loves the Boxster. I am really hoping we are able to keep it, because if I sell it I know I will never again find one as nice as the one I have. At the same time, I would like to have the money to invest.
The best scenario, and I think I've mentioned this in the past, is that I buy your car, drive it for a few years and use it to sort out if I really get enough use out of a weekend/fun car, and/or if I really want a roadster or a coupe. Then I sell it for (hopefully) a pretty small loss and invest in a gently used '09+ P-car.
...then there is the "to hell with it, a sportscar will never work" approach where I just swap my ZHP for an M3 sedan that I can use everyday.
dredmo
12-11-2008, 02:57 PM
Ruh Roh, Poll seems to be reopened.
Elise!
clyde
12-11-2008, 03:28 PM
:lol:
Now, the question is... does user title #1 explain user title #2?
Only cuz you're waiting so long. :p
dredmo
12-11-2008, 03:43 PM
2,147,483,647
!!!!
2,147,483,647
!!!!
Time to switch to a bigint before the system crashes!
2,147,483,647
!!!!
Bimmerforum's got nothin' on us.:cool:
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