my perservate [Archive] - carmudgeons.com

Jeff_DML

11-07-2007, 01:38 PM

I was planning on getting a Euro delivered 135 or 335 late spring of next year to replace my wrx. But I recently knocked up my wife again and she is due at the end of may so that sort of changes things:) Also been thinking my commute is only a few miles and I also ride my bike to work a few times a week so buying a shiny new depreciating item seems a bit silly for me.

With that said I have been thinking of selling the wrx and get a older 911 to replace it. I wont put many miles on it, already depriciated so i can sell it in a few years for little loss, and if it breaks down no biggie, still can get to work on my bike. I think I can sell the rex in the lower to mid teens so I would look for a 911 for about the same price. For that money I was think I can get one in the 80s, 911 SC I think.

sound like a stupid idea? Any suggestions on what to look for? rennlist and local PCA probably the best place to look for one?

11-07-2007, 01:49 PM

Congrats, man!

I don't have any advice on the 911. I gave up thinking that I can own a 2-seater with kids about the time I sold the S2000.

Jeff_DML

11-07-2007, 02:03 PM

Congrats, man!

I don't have any advice on the 911. I gave up thinking that I can own a 2-seater with kids about the time I sold the S2000.

thanks, I know the rear seats are pretty useless but I figure i can squeeze in the child seats if need be.

JST

11-07-2007, 02:16 PM

thanks, I know the rear seats are pretty useless but I figure i can squeeze in the child seats if need be.

Eh. Maybe. I looked into this pretty closely. I'd do your own research (rennlist forums were good, PCA tech forums not as much), but my conclusion was that a 911 of any vintage is going to have a hard time accepting a rear-facing car seat in the back seat. On a pre-airbag 911, you could always put the rear-facing seat in the front, but then you pretty much make it impossible to carry a passenger in the back.

Once you get into forward facing seats, it becomes easier. I've seen pictures of a variety of 911s (including the older Carrera 3.2s, so probably also SCs) with Britax Roundabouts or similar in the back seats, and there is a 964 near my house that has a Roundabout fitted forward-facing in the back. I test-fitted a Roundabout into a 996, and it worked fine forward facing, but rear-facing was not really workable.

At the end of the day, when I was first thinking about this, I decided that it just wasn't possible to do a rear-facing seat in a 911 and still be able to carry an adult passenger, and that I would have to wait until the kid was forward-facing to get a 911. Then, once she was old enough, I decided I didn't really want to spend the money on a 911.

rumatt

11-07-2007, 02:31 PM

But I recently knocked up my wife again

Congrats!

Jeff_DML

11-07-2007, 02:43 PM

Eh. Maybe. I looked into this pretty closely. I'd do your own research (rennlist forums were good, PCA tech forums not as much), but my conclusion was that a 911 of any vintage is going to have a hard time accepting a rear-facing car seat in the back seat. On a pre-airbag 911, you could always put the rear-facing seat in the front, but then you pretty much make it impossible to carry a passenger in the back.

Once you get into forward facing seats, it becomes easier. I've seen pictures of a variety of 911s (including the older Carrera 3.2s, so probably also SCs) with Britax Roundabouts or similar in the back seats, and there is a 964 near my house that has a Roundabout fitted forward-facing in the back. I test-fitted a Roundabout into a 996, and it worked fine forward facing, but rear-facing was not really workable.

At the end of the day, when I was first thinking about this, I decided that it just wasn't possible to do a rear-facing seat in a 911 and still be able to carry an adult passenger, and that I would have to wait until the kid was forward-facing to get a 911. Then, once she was old enough, I decided I didn't really want to spend the money on a 911.

duh, forgot about the rear facing seats :irate:

Jeff_DML

11-07-2007, 03:54 PM

Does make you wonder how did anyone of us ever survived to our age what with no child seat, crappy brakes, and no baby priifing around the house.

my dad said his mom used to put her arm out as a seatbelt when he was sitting next to her on the front bench seat:D

Jeff_DML

11-07-2007, 03:54 PM

But yeah, that pretty much destroys any 2+2 options.:irate:

you guys expecting soon?:eeps:

wdc330i

11-07-2007, 04:15 PM

my dad said his mom used to put her arm out as a seatbelt when he was sitting next to her on the front bench seat:D

My parents tell me they used to put me in a basket on the dashboard of their Isetta when I was a baby.

wdc330i

11-07-2007, 04:16 PM

11-07-2007, 04:57 PM

I'd love to get an early 997S but they are still VERY pricey. I'll take a look again late next year vs. leftover 987S'/CaymanS' on the lots.

equ

11-07-2007, 04:57 PM

When I was a kid I used to shock myself by sticking metal wires into the sockets.:cool:

Am I the only person recognizing the explanatory power of this statement? :confused:

JST

11-07-2007, 05:00 PM

So what new car did you decide upon in the interim? Why is no one chasing this story?

I bid on LiLo's SL65, but didn't make the reserve.

Pics of the new ride will be posted some time, after I take them.

11-07-2007, 05:21 PM

I'd love to get an early 997S but they are still VERY pricey. I'll take a look again late next year vs. leftover 987S'/CaymanS' on the lots.
I'm at least one lease down the road from seriously working this idea.

17 months remaining with my 330i. Then a 2-3 year lease of something else (135i?, TT?, S4?). And then (maybe) I'll be able to pull off the 911.

And by then, you all will even be able to call me "middle-aged". I'll be pushing 40.

Melissa

11-07-2007, 06:06 PM

:line: :group: :groupjump

11-07-2007, 06:27 PM

:line: :group: :groupjump
Oh yeah... CONGRATS on the knock up!

wdc330i

11-07-2007, 06:50 PM

Oh yeah... CONGRATS on the knock up!

Me, three!

lemming

11-09-2007, 09:35 AM

I'm at least one lease down the road from seriously working this idea.

17 months remaining with my 330i. Then a 2-3 year lease of something else (135i?, TT?, S4?). And then (maybe) I'll be able to pull off the 911.

And by then, you all will even be able to call me "middle-aged". I'll be pushing 40.

:dunno:

whenever in my life asks me about 911 advice, i tell them to drive both a boxster and a (an aircooled 911) on the same set of test drives. just so they know what they are potential gaining (patina) and losing (reliability, modern engineering).

11-09-2007, 11:10 AM

I am really curious to drive a 911. I've never driven one. I should just go drive a 997/S and get that out of my system.

JST

11-09-2007, 11:37 AM

I am really curious to drive a 911. I've never driven one. I should just go drive a 997/S and get that out of my system.

Eh...I'm not sure I would do that. The Boxster handles better, but the 911 is a LOT faster (even in 996 form--I haven't driven a 997). While I think even the 3.2 997S has sufficient power to be interesting (in contrast to the 986S, which doesn't really offer sufficient straight line drama), they both feel a bit sluggish next to the 911. Driving a 997 might spoil the 987 for you.

Nick M3

11-09-2007, 11:47 AM

JST

11-09-2007, 12:00 PM

FWIW, the maintenance money that my girlfriend spends on her 993s would pay the lease on a 135i. I shudder to think of what a really old one would be like.

Ironically, the C4 seems to cost her more than the Turbo. :p

I think it is important, at this juncture, to highlight a few of the thoughts outlined in Nick's post.

I can only assume that Nick's girlfriend is Jessica Seinfeld. Don't tell Jerry. He will be very angry.

Please pardon this interruption.

11-09-2007, 01:14 PM

I think it is important, at this juncture, to highlight a few of the thoughts outlined in Nick's post.

I can only assume that Nick's girlfriend is Jessica Seinfeld. Don't tell Jerry. He will be very angry.

Please pardon this interruption.

LOL

Anyway, on the 997S speed thing. You may be right. I better see if I am even in the market before bothering. Last time I checked, '05 997S' were still asking silly prices in the 70K's. Maybe now that we're offically into MY08 prices have dipped. My hope is that at this time next year (or later) when the '05's will be 4 y.o. and possibly even out of warranty that I can find a 997S for about 50K, otherwise I'm going with a 987. And no, I don't want a base 997.

JST

11-09-2007, 01:20 PM

LOL

Anyway, on the 997S speed thing. You may be right. I better see if I am even in the market before bothering. Last time I checked, '05 997S' were still asking silly prices in the 70K's. Maybe now that we're offically into MY08 prices have dipped. My hope is that at this time next year (or later) when the '05's will be 4 y.o. and possibly even out of warranty that I can find a 997S for about 50K, otherwise I'm going with a 987. And no, I don't want a base 997.

Without driving both, how do you know that the S is worth it?

11-09-2007, 01:27 PM

Without driving both, how do you know that the S is worth it?

Because I like torque and the goodies that come std on the 997S are a bargain new, nevermind used - such as Xenons, PASM, 19", sport wheel, bigger/better brakes, etc. Plus the 997 wont be much faster than a 3.4L 987, so at that point why pay the big premium.

But these are just guesses/assumptions.

Optimus Prime

11-09-2007, 02:05 PM

When I was a kid I used to shock myself by sticking metal wires into the sockets.:cool:

Am I the only person recognizing the explanatory power of this statement? :confused:

Nope. My first thought was, "well that explains a lot..." :eeps:

11-09-2007, 02:54 PM

996 Turbo, just go drive it.

And just because I hate AWD doesn't mean you will too. It really is a very nice daily car, and you won't need a new lower lip spoiler every 2 days like you do with the GT2.

I'm not listening to your evil comments. Last time I did I spent way too much time reading up on it. My conclusion then was that it was a lot of money for an older car that could/will cost a lot to maintain/repair. Plus, I REALLY prefer the looks of the 997 in and out. Still, I'm not ruling it out. For all my 987 talk, I'm open to considering...

986S
987
987S (3.2 and 3.4) <- Frontrunner
Cayman S
996C2
996TT
997S
C6 Coupe
MZ4 :eeps:
Elise

Longshots: S2000 and (if available) MS MX-5.

John V

11-09-2007, 03:05 PM

I'm open to considering...

986S

Buy mine. :)

11-09-2007, 03:10 PM

Buy mine. :)

I thought you liked yours. What's wrong with it.:?

:D

Jeff_DML

11-09-2007, 03:17 PM

good trunk money on mz4 right now, $7500 I think

11-09-2007, 03:46 PM

good trunk money on mz4 right now, $7500 I think

That is a LOT of trunk money.:eek:

11-09-2007, 03:49 PM

That is a LOT of trunk money.:eek:
After which, you've still spend a lot of money on a very, very ugly car.

That's still $50K. I can think of a lot of things I'd rather buy with $50K.

Jeff_DML

11-09-2007, 03:51 PM

from here

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showpost.php?p=33232&postcount=15

John V

11-09-2007, 03:53 PM

I thought you liked yours. What's wrong with it.:?

:D

I do like it. Lots. In fact, I really don't expect to sell it. I would certainly never find another one with this particular option set (which I find to be pretty much ideal).

But if someone came along and really wanted it, I'm sure I could find another car to drive :eeps:

And nothing is wrong with it. Just starting to get a bit of wanderlust, especially since I won't be driving it the next few months now that I have a beater..

11-09-2007, 04:00 PM

from here

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showpost.php?p=33232&postcount=15

"I got the Z4M coupe for about $46K OUT THE DOOR with an MSRP of $57K. I turned in my E46 M3 lease in early too."

Holy cow. Sounds like a lot less than 50K, TD. But yeah, it is still an ugly car. A cheap to own car, but still. Basically, I just want to drive one before I buy any car. Due diligence, that's all.

11-09-2007, 04:01 PM

I do like it. Lots. In fact, I really don't expect to sell it. I would certainly never find another one with this particular option set (which I find to be pretty much ideal).

But if someone came along and really wanted it, I'm sure I could find another car to drive :eeps:

And nothing is wrong with it. Just starting to get a bit of wanderlust, especially since I won't be driving it the next few months now that I have a beater..

Just so I can annoy myself over the weekend, what would you be looking for, ballpark?

11-09-2007, 04:03 PM

"I got the Z4M coupe for about $46K OUT THE DOOR with an MSRP of $57K. I turned in my E46 M3 lease in early too."

Holy cow. Sounds like a lot less than 50K, TD. But yeah, it is still an ugly car. A cheap to own car, but still. Basically, I just want to drive one before I buy any car. Due diligence, that's all.
Well, to me $46K isn't "a lot" less than $50K. I was guessing invoice + options less trunk money would end up around $49K. Of course, take away an option or two...

It's still way too much money to pay for something that you really didn't love.

John V

11-09-2007, 04:17 PM

FC, I PM'd you.

lemming

11-09-2007, 04:21 PM

as Roundel alluded to in this month's issue where they take the z4 coupe 3.0si versus the TT 3.2s, it'd be cool to have the twin turbo 3.0l engine in that car.

11-09-2007, 04:38 PM

FC, I PM'd you.

Replied. Thanks.:)

JST

11-09-2007, 05:03 PM

as Roundel alluded to in this month's issue where they take the z4 coupe 3.0si versus the TT 3.2s, it'd be cool to have the twin turbo 3.0l engine in that car.

Honestly, in a car like the Z4 I'd rather have the S54 (and the M-Lock differential).

lemming

11-09-2007, 05:14 PM

Honestly, in a car like the Z4 I'd rather have the S54 (and the M-Lock differential).

ah.

i keep forgetting that BMW does not fit cars with limited slip units anymore without the M(arketing) badge.

Jeff_DML

11-09-2007, 05:19 PM

Honestly, in a car like the Z4 I'd rather have the S54 (and the M-Lock differential).

what if you could get a LSD with the 3.0TT? or still rather get the S54?

JST

11-09-2007, 05:22 PM

what if you could get a LSD with the 3.0TT? or still rather get the S54?

In the Z4? Probably. The 3.0TT is a great engine, but it still has a bit of throttle softness that comes from the turbos; it's fine for a big coupe/sedan, but in a "sports car" I'd want something with a harder edge.

lemming

11-09-2007, 05:31 PM

In the Z4? Probably. The 3.0TT is a great engine, but it still has a bit of throttle softness that comes from the turbos; it's fine for a big coupe/sedan, but in a "sports car" I'd want something with a harder edge.

here's my problem, and it's on topic for the thread:

BMWs are always expensive for what they are. in the recent past, it was easily (for me) to justify the added cost because i was getting something that i could perceive as worth the added cost.

when it gets into the realm of that elusive third car whose purpose in life is to be focused and be good at going fast, BMW never even comes into my mind.

i just helped someone get GM supplier pricing on an LS3-powered (6.2litre 430hp) C6 with the 4LT package (new handstitched leather interior bits and pieces) for probably 'less' than the z4 3.0Si.

when i know i can always access the GM employee pricing structure, i rue the thought of ever driving a "sports car" from BMW......or even Porsche for that matter.

now that the C6RS is for sale (basically a bespoke Katech car), the new ZR-1 is coming and so forth, i just cannot imagine spending my own money paying for anything else.

i couldn't help but scratch my head at the new M3's power numbers. v8 power. 414hp. less than 300ft-lbs of torque. that i'm going to get those numbers in the upcoming g8 sedan with the 6spd and better fuel economy.....i understand BMW less and less. true. i must just not get it. but BMW, more and more, is becoming the $2000 quartz movement watch (think Porsche Cayenne and you'll understand the metaphor).

clyde

11-09-2007, 06:42 PM

Replied. Thanks.:)
FC, dunno if jv included it in his price, but he may have neglected to mention that it includes towing to your location at no additional cost.

11-09-2007, 07:24 PM

FC, dunno if jv included it in his price, but he may have neglected to mention that it includes towing to your location at no additional cost.

That's a pretty neat throw-in. Why, are you planning on coming along?;) ...Though a trip down (up) the east coast wouldn't scare me either.

I brought it up to the Mrs, that it would basically not cost much more than the 330i is worth, but we really do need to have two cars than can take a car seat, so if I "swap" the ZHP for the 986S, I'd need to get a beater of some sort, like the planned beater cherokee. So now we are talking several K more. But of course, with the new baby and all, she will hear none of it. Nevermind, that all of a sudden I saw a big attachment to the ZHP from her. I would not be against adding a $2X-K car on top of keeping the ZHP, but it just can't happen soon. That would have to wait several months.

I'll keep thinking about it though.

clyde

11-09-2007, 08:52 PM

That's a pretty neat throw-in. Why, are you planning on coming along?;)

I figured that I'd just john the Armada to go up there...let him and his woman have a nice relaxing tow up to and back from the NE.

And if it increases my chances of autocrossing a car that I'm more excited about next year, so be it.

:eeps:

John V

11-10-2007, 08:15 AM

That's a pretty neat throw-in. Why, are you planning on coming along?;) ...Though a trip down (up) the east coast wouldn't scare me either.

I brought it up to the Mrs, that it would basically not cost much more than the 330i is worth, but we really do need to have two cars than can take a car seat, so if I "swap" the ZHP for the 986S, I'd need to get a beater of some sort, like the planned beater cherokee. So now we are talking several K more. But of course, with the new baby and all, she will hear none of it. Nevermind, that all of a sudden I saw a big attachment to the ZHP from her. I would not be against adding a $2X-K car on top of keeping the ZHP, but it just can't happen soon. That would have to wait several months.

I'll keep thinking about it though.

It comes with snow tires mounted on seperate alloys.

Who needs a beater? :eeps:

11-10-2007, 10:36 AM

It comes with snow tires mounted on seperate alloys.

Who needs a beater? :eeps:

That's cool. But it's the "how do I get my kid to daycare if somehow the V70R is not available" thing. It's a remote chance, but still. Like I said, I'm still thinking about it.

First I need to find a local 986S to test-drive (though I know the 030 suspension makes a big difference).

clyde

11-10-2007, 10:39 AM

we really do need to have two cars than can take a car seat

This is sort of an aside, but why do so many new parents think this?

In the three years I had the RX-8 (bought with a nearly two year old and a second on the way), I can count on two fingers the number of times that not having bought a two seater like a Z06 would have caused an issue for us when it came to moving the kids...and if it had been a Z06 instead of the RX-8, we would have found a way.

rumatt

11-10-2007, 10:40 AM

FC, dunno if jv included it in his price, but he may have neglected to mention that it includes towing to your location at no additional cost.

Tow whore.

clyde

11-10-2007, 10:46 AM

That's cool. But it's the "how do I get my kid to daycare if somehow the V70R is not available" thing. It's a remote chance, but still. Like I said, I'm still thinking about it.

What if both cars (whatever they may be) are unavailable?

Why do you keep the 330 with it's stick in case your wife needs to take the kid somewhere, you have to go somewhere else, and you somehow can't manage to drive a stick?

How far do you go in making compromises that "negatively" impact every waking day to protect yourself against very unlikley, very remotely possible events?

11-10-2007, 04:15 PM

What if both cars (whatever they may be) are unavailable?

Why do you keep the 330 with it's stick in case your wife needs to take the kid somewhere, you have to go somewhere else, and you somehow can't manage to drive a stick?

How far do you go in making compromises that "negatively" impact every waking day to protect yourself against very unlikley, very remotely possible events?

Well, on the stickshift thing, I had no control. SHE wanted a slushy. Since that wont change, I appriciate it when it does become necessary. That's all.

On the "needing two cars with a backseat" thing, I do disagree with my wife. If the V70R is ever broken, we'd get a loaner. Still, that does mean that if she has to start driving to the train station on her own, she would be the one driving the 986 and I'd be stuck driving the slushy wagon to work. I rather keep the 330i instead (as much as it would be fun to have the 986 for the weekends).

In reality, absolutely nothing can happen until Feb/March. I simply don't have the money to buy the car, I cannot have just one car (say if I were to decide to sell the 330i first and use those funds), and I'm not taking on a loan for a few months. Plus, more importantly, my wife will go back to work in Jan, and I want at least a month to gauge our needs. There is a reason behind The Plan, and I'm technically 1.5 years away from it still.

But the thought of JV's car is still tempting enough to make ne think about it despite all that.