Tesla Model ≡ Thread

[clyde]

Originally Posted by JST

Have you taken the Rav 4 hybrid for a drive on a winding road with the engine off and the windows down?

Idk, it's not the tires squealing, but it's the tires making noise on the road. Not sure how else to explain it.

Is it something you hear only with power applied? Because if you ask the RAV4 for more than a small amount of thrust, the engine kicks back on.

If turns with a modest amount of lateral acceleration counts, but not necessarily thrust, then yes and I don't recall anything like you describe...which I'm still having a hard time imagining being anything but something tightly tied to the specific combination of speeds, pavement type, tire (including treadblock shape, size, depth, and compound), surroundings, and other environmental conditions.

We may not be able to get any further on this with just written words.

[robg]

Originally Posted by JST

I don't get a chance to drive the Model 3 that much anymore, and the chances to drive it on twisty roads are even rarer.

But yesterday I took it to drop the kid off at camp in central VA and had a chance to enjoy some rural country roads in it, solo. These aren't exactly California-spec curvy roads; I didn't even get into the mountains by the Shenandoah Valley. But they were fairly entertaining.

I have to say, all the bullshit about Tesla aside, this is a fun and satisfying car to drive. It's not like the Boxster, but it has its rewards--being able to hear everything, from the birds to the sizzle of the tires in the curves, is really cool. The heavy regen gives you an uncanny feeling of control which is fantastic on an unfamiliar road, where you don't want to be braking super late anyway. And the power...well.

I ended up behind a Buick that was proceeding at Buickpace and when I came to a passing zone I gave the Tesla full whack from about 30 mph and...holy fuck I kind of forgot how fast it is. Like, I almost drove into the ditch because it surprised me so much kind of fast. There is just nothing like the overtaking you can do with this car.

It really is something else, especially because it's so quiet and unassuming otherwise.

That's really all you can ask for in a daily driver type car...practical enough yet fun and engaging on normal roads. As I consider my next car, I have to admit that the Model 3 occupies an appealing space in terms of cost/practicality/fun/size. Taking it off the table, I'll either end up most likely getting something like an Audi S5 SB or spending a lot more and getting some form of Taycan.

I was also on a nice twisty road this weekend...even in our SUV it's fun but I got stuck behind several Subarus and Lexi doing 10 under the speed limit.

[Plaz]

Admittedly drive by semi-drunk posting here but I have a hard time believing anyone here doesn't by definition completely understand the appeal of having outrageously ridiculous instantaneous kidney-punching acceleration on tap at all times. I mean, come on.

[John V]

I understand the appeal for sure. But practically speaking, it is a party trick that gets old after a couple times behind the wheel. The other things that make enjoyable cars enjoyable like chassis balance, steering and brake feel and ride quality never get old. At least not to me.

[clyde]

Originally Posted by Plaz

Admittedly drive by semi-drunk posting here but I have a hard time believing anyone here doesn't by definition completely understand the appeal of having outrageously ridiculous instantaneous kidney-punching acceleration on tap at all times. I mean, come on.

I spend an unwisely large portion of my time thinking about and playing with automobiles. The center of that attention is autocross, not drag racing.

No objection to having a stupifying amount of power under my right foot, but the value of that appeal dwindles rapidly when the opportunities to use it are so rare. Things that can be appreciated while sitting still at a traffic light and when stuck behind a train of cars led by a Prius trundling along 3 mph below the already way-to-low posted speed limit provide more relative value because they can be used and appreciated more often.

[JST]

Originally Posted by clyde

I spend an unwisely large portion of my time thinking about and playing with automobiles. The center of that attention is autocross, not drag racing.

No objection to having a stupifying amount of power under my right foot, but the value of that appeal dwindles rapidly when the opportunities to use it are so rare. Things that can be appreciated while sitting still at a traffic light and when stuck behind a train of cars led by a Prius trundling along 3 mph below the already way-to-low posted speed limit provide more relative value because they can be used and appreciated more often.

I mean, in that circumstance the instant torque of an EV is something you can appreciate way more frequently than a taut chassis.

The Tesla's power is a party trick but eventually you stop gunning it from light to light and just start to appreciate how effortless it makes all city driving, from dawdling along to passing to inserting yourself into small gaps.

In that sense it's way more useful than the power in the M3, which is a lot more trouble to access and mostly doesn't do anything for you around town.

[zach]

Originally Posted by Plaz

Admittedly drive by semi-drunk posting here but I have a hard time believing anyone here doesn't by definition completely understand the appeal of having outrageously ridiculous instantaneous kidney-punching acceleration on tap at all times. I mean, come on.

I agree with this 100%

[Theo]

Originally Posted by JST

I mean, in that circumstance the instant torque of an EV is something you can appreciate way more frequently than a taut chassis.

The Tesla's power is a party trick but eventually you stop gunning it from light to light and just start to appreciate how effortless it makes all city driving, from dawdling along to passing to inserting yourself into small gaps.

In that sense it's way more useful than the power in the M3, which is a lot more trouble to access and mostly doesn't do anything for you around town.

Then what purpose does the M3 serve? Do you still like it?

[JST]

Originally Posted by Theo

Then what purpose does the M3 serve? Do you still like it?

I do! It's a very different driving experience than the Tesla, and is rewarding in its own right. I keep it because I need to have two four-door cars, still. If I had to choose between the Model 3 and the M3, I'm honestly not sure which way I'd go. The Model 3 is (perhaps surprisingly) far more practical and a lot easier to drive; in addition to exceling around town, it's frankly a better trip car, too, because it has more space and is more comfortable on the highway. The M3 is kind of loud and tiresome after a few hours on the interstate.

But the M3 is fun in an analogue, muscle-car kind of way, and it's neat to hear the turbos spool, and a manual transmission is still more rewarding than the Tesla. Plus, there are still some very small corner cases where a gas car is easier to use than an EV (though given the size of the Tesla charging network, around here those cases are really rare).

I also don't see them making a better car than the M3 any time soon, with the possible exception of the G87, so maybe I just have to hold this one until the bearings spin.

[clyde]

Originally Posted by JST

I mean, in that circumstance the instant torque of an EV is something you can appreciate way more frequently than a taut chassis.

I have tons of skepticism about that comparison even if I can't be certain until I live with one for a while.

A well-damped, taut chassis is something you can feel and appreciate with every motion of the car no matter what its non-zero speed or proximity to the edge of its envelope. The behavior and feel at its limits are something separate. It's what you feel when you're taking a casual stroll with the car, not what it's like to try dancing with it.

The first time I really understood this was on an off-ramp at an anonymous and totally unremarkable speed the first night I had the RX-8. The tiniest changes in throttle input had a most predictable and natural effect on the car's arc. This was not in a high-strung, nervous, or twitchy kind of way, but rather in a this-is-how-it's-supposed-to-work way. It was not something that any "normal" driver would have noticed, but very much present and someone attuned to vehicle dynamics couldn't miss.