Actually considering an I-Pace

[robg]

I think we all discussed this car when it came out and sort of dismissed it due to the range not being great, etc. At the time, I didn't really love the design either. 3 years later, it should be even more irrelevant given the plethora of long range EVs available now.

Anyway, I walked by one the other day and realized that I actually liked the design of it. Decided to do some research on it and really liked the specs/packaging of it. Only 184" long but good interior/cargo room. Crossover-ish styling but with air suspension you can achieve a more sedan like ride height. Most reviews praise the handling and ride quality as well. 0-60 in about 4 seconds isn't as fast some in this price range but realistically more than quick enough. Most tests seem to put it at about 250 real world miles in terms of range; similar to most of the recent crop of EVs..actually better than some such as E-tron and Taycan CT. Downside is peak charging speed, but again, many of the real world tests put it in the same ballpark as all but the charging champions (E-tron and Taycan). Also the infotainment isn't the best- but Im used to that now. Plus, the reality is, we only drive about 1000 miles a year worth of road trips that would even require DC fast charging.

It also occurred to me that it would keep a lot of what I've grown to love about the Range Rover Sport: extremely comfortable seats, good ride quality, natural steering feel/weight, great brakes, solid build quality, and generally high quality/pleasing interior design but in an EV package with much lower running cossts. Seems like a small thing but I also like that it still has physical knobs for climate and volume. I guess having survived Land Rover ownership with only a few minor gltiches, I'm not as scared of JLR products as I might once have been from a reliability standpoint.

They seem to have simplified the lineup down to just 1 model and have lowered the price vs past years. When all is said and done, I think I could get one the way I'd want it out the door in the low 60s (factoring in tax credits). That compares favorably with my other 2 runner ups for nice daily drivers in this price range: X3 40i and S5 sportback. While the infotainment system won't be as slick in the Jag and road trips won't be quite as easy, I think overall I'd be happier 95% of the time. Honestly, none of the other sub 70k EVs really appeal time; they all have major dealbreakers. Q4 came the closest to being acceptable but upon further research Im not sure I'd be happy with it. The big etron SUV would be even more luxury/comfort oriented but too much of a big, heavy boat.

A Taycan CT would still be my dream daily driver, but at 100k+ it really leaves me no room in the budget for 2nd car (and spec-wise the Jag actually exceeds the "CT4" in nearly every way other than charging speed). I may still decide to spend much less and just get a GTI...but the new one has several characteristics that could be deal breakers. And while its cheaper and probably more fun, I think the reality is that I'd be happier spendinhg more on a daily driver that provides better comfort/ride quality/convenience and less on a sports car that I'd only get to use occasionally. Anyway just random musings for the day.

flamesuit on...

[JST]

Originally Posted by robg

I think we all discussed this car when it came out and sort of dismissed it due to the range not being great, etc. At the time, I didn't really love the design either. 3 years later, it should be even more irrelevant given the plethora of long range EVs available now.

Anyway, I walked by one the other day and realized that I actually liked the design of it. Decided to do some research on it and really liked the specs/packaging of it. Only 184" long but good interior/cargo room. Crossover-ish styling but with air suspension you can achieve a more sedan like ride height. Most reviews praise the handling and ride quality as well. 0-60 in about 4 seconds isn't as fast some in this price range but realistically more than quick enough. Most tests seem to put it at about 250 real world miles in terms of range; similar to most of the recent crop of EVs..actually better than some such as E-tron and Taycan CT. Downside is peak charging speed, but again, many of the real world tests put it in the same ballpark as all but the charging champions (E-tron and Taycan). Also the infotainment isn't the best- but Im used to that now. Plus, the reality is, we only drive about 1000 miles a year worth of road trips that would even require DC fast charging.

It also occurred to me that it would keep a lot of what I've grown to love about the Range Rover Sport: extremely comfortable seats, good ride quality, natural steering feel/weight, great brakes, solid build quality, and generally high quality/pleasing interior design but in an EV package with much lower running cossts. Seems like a small thing but I also like that it still has physical knobs for climate and volume. I guess having survived Land Rover ownership with only a few minor gltiches, I'm not as scared of JLR products as I might once have been from a reliability standpoint.

They seem to have simplified the lineup down to just 1 model and have lowered the price vs past years. When all is said and done, I think I could get one the way I'd want it out the door in the low 60s (factoring in tax credits). That compares favorably with my other 2 runner ups for nice daily drivers in this price range: X3 40i and S5 sportback. While the infotainment system won't be as slick in the Jag and road trips won't be quite as easy, I think overall I'd be happier 95% of the time. Honestly, none of the other sub 70k EVs really appeal time; they all have major dealbreakers. Q4 came the closest to being acceptable but upon further research Im not sure I'd be happy with it.

A Taycan CT would still be my dream daily driver, but at 100k+ it really leaves me no room in the budget for 2nd car. I may still decide to spend much less and just get a GTI...but the new one has several characteristics that could be deal breakers. And while its cheaper and probably more fun, I think the reality is that I'd be happier spendinhg more on a daily driver that provides better comfort/ride quality/convenience and less on a sports car that I'd only get to use occasionally. Anyway just random musings for the day.

flamesuit on...

For me, the question with something like an i-Pace is "how does this compare to the Mach E," which I think at this point is the de facto class of the segment. That's especially true of the i-Pace, which feels like it's now a generation behind in terms of battery tech and efficiency.

[robg]

Originally Posted by JST

For me, the question with something like an i-Pace is "how does this compare to the Mach E," which I think at this point is the de facto class of the segment. That's especially true of the i-Pace, which feels like it's now a generation behind in terms of battery tech and efficiency.

Maybe but most real world tests seem to put a LR AWD Mach E at about the same range as an ipace. It’s average charging speed is better but not as much as the peak ratings woukd suggest. Also, with the Mach E I’d have to get the GT version to avoid fake leather and get adaptive shocks which will likely have even less range. At that point I’m already in the same price range and I get a car with a less comfortable and nice interior in exchange for a faster 0-60 time that I don’t care about. Plus I still prefer the looks of the ipace over the Mach E.


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[clyde]

How long do you intend to keep it? If it's a year or two and you're okay taking a bigger hit on resale, I can see giving the i-Pace a shot. If it's longer or resale is more of a factor, I'd have a hard time picking it over the Mustang. Because Jaguar, mostly.

Even so, what's the worst that could happen? It's not like a lifetime commitment.

ABT

[wdc330i]

Can you lease it?

[robg]

Originally Posted by wdc330i

Can you lease it?

Yeah but I’ll have to see if they pass through the tax credit. If not it’s not worth leasing .


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[robg]

Originally Posted by robg

Maybe but most real world tests seem to put a LR AWD Mach E at about the same range as an ipace. It’s average charging speed is better but not as much as the peak ratings woukd suggest. Also, with the Mach E I’d have to get the GT version to avoid fake leather and get adaptive shocks which will likely have even less range. At that point I’m already in the same price range and I get a car with a less comfortable and nice interior in exchange for a faster 0-60 time that I don’t care about. Plus I still prefer the looks of the ipace over the Mach E.


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I’d probably keep it 3-4 years unless it was a complete lemon. And if it was, there’s recourse for that. I actually am less worried about the ipace since it’s now been on the market a few years. I’d feel less comfortable buying one of these first year EVs. Even Porsche seems to be struggling a bit with the taycan : lots of people reporting rattles, 12v battery issues, going into “turtle” mode, lots of infotainment issues, etc . I always prefer buying the facelift version of a car and that’s where the ipace is in its lifecycle now


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[ZBB]

I think the I-Pace is gorgeous -- both outside and in. But range is its biggest issue -- 222 miles is the EPA rating.

That will be OK if you are using it for commuting and around town things. But if you are planning any road trips, just make sure there are CCS chargers at least every ~140 miles on the routes you are planning on driving. Plugshare.com is a great resource for planning.

My first Tesla had the small battery, and only had 208 miles of range when new. By the time I sold it, range was about 190. We did plenty of road trips in it, but I think the longest distance driven between charges was about 170 miles (back when the battery had about 200 miles of range) -- and that included a stretch where we drove 5 under the limit for about 50 miles just to make sure we could make the next Supercharger...

The nice thing about EV's that have ~300 mile range these days is that you no longer worry about that. You can drive 5-10 over the limit and not worry. The biggest gaps we've driven in either the Y or 3 have been under 200 miles, and we can easily skip a Supercharger and hit the next one. It really is the range that makes EV road trips super easy.

[ZBB]

Originally Posted by robg

Yeah but I’ll have to see if they pass through the tax credit. If not it’s not worth leasing .

The lease fine print at Jaguar's site is interesting. References a $7500 lease credit, but only mentions "eligible 2020" models -- but the lease is otherwise for a 2022 model...

Originally Posted by jaguarusa.com

$839 FIRST MONTH’S PAYMENT
$4,261 DOWN PAYMENT
$0 SECURITY DEPOSIT
$895 ACQUISITION FEE

* New 2022 Jaguar I-PACE HSE with 36-month lease, $5,995 due at signing includes $4,261 down, $0 security deposit, $895 acquisition fee and first month's payment; excludes retailer fees, taxes, title and registration fees, processing fee and any emission testing charge. Adjusted capitalized cost used in calculating your monthly payment is based on a capitalized cost reduction that includes a $7,500 lease credit for eligible 2020 Jaguar I-PACE vehicles. Actual rates and payments of closed-end lease may vary. Supplies are limited. For well-qualified lessees as determined by approved lender. All amounts shown are estimates; retailer sets actual amounts. Lessee responsible for insurance, maintenance, excess wear and excess mileage over 30,000 miles at $0.30/mile. Based on MSRP of $77,600 (excludes destination and handling). Total of lease payments $30,204. Residency restrictions apply. Lessee has option to purchase vehicle at lease end at price negotiated with retailer and approved lender at signing. Termination fee may apply. Customer must take new vehicle delivery from retailer stock by 11/1/2021. Jaguar or approved lender may rescind or amend this offer without notice. Model pictured may vary from offer. See your participating Jaguar Retailer for complete details, or call 1.800.4.JAGUAR / 1.800.452.4827. © 2021 Jaguar Land Rover North America, LLC

[robg]

Originally Posted by ZBB

The lease fine print at Jaguar's site is interesting. References a $7500 lease credit, but only mentions "eligible 2020" models -- but the lease is otherwise for a 2022 model...

Ha yeah I noticed that as well. When I tried to reverse engineer the lease quote (factoring in the down payment), it only worked out if I assumed a 7500 credit - so maybe they are still offering that on the 2022s. I think I’d want more of a discount than that to pull actually pull the trigger though.


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