Base Taycan announced (RWD/80k). Anyone intrigued?

[JST]

Originally Posted by robg

So that c&d article on the Tesla says their fuel range was 237 for that period but doesn’t mention the 75mph test results (as far as I can tell). Found this article that mentions the results (for their 75 mph test) they got for a 2018 model 3 was 200 miles?

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...3-test-review/

The taycan they tested was on 21” wheels so that could easily account for the difference.

Anyway on DC run woukd you really be able to average anything close to 75mph?

Fwiw, this guy (Tesla bjorn) got 264 miles in his 120km/hr range test on a 4s equipped with the 19s. He only got 243 miles on a Tesla model 3 performance on 18s. Point being it’s too close to call to say that either one is definitively better in terms of range

https://youtu.be/VB24iJbusgQ


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The more I look at it, the more I think Car and Driver's data is basically useless because they not only don't control for temp data, they don't even provide the temps for the tests in a consistent fashion. The Tesla 200 mile result they describe as being "hovering around freezing" and the Porsche result "48 degrees, dropping to under 40 toward the end;" those are potentially big differences, but it's hard to know for sure.

Also, lol, the Taycan is shipping with Hankook tires? Jebus.

[robg]

Originally Posted by JST

The more I look at it, the more I think Car and Driver's data is basically useless because they not only don't control for temp data, they don't even provide the temps for the tests in a consistent fashion. The Tesla 200 mile result they describe as being "hovering around freezing" and the Porsche result "48 degrees, dropping to under 40 toward the end;" those are potentially big differences, but it's hard to know for sure.



Also, lol, the Taycan is shipping with Hankook tires? Jebus.

Ha- yeah I saw that. Another way they punish you for getting the ugly base wheels. FWIW It looks like the taycan he tested with 20” wheels came with Michelin ps4s


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[clyde]

Would all shut up already about why this might not be an awesome car?

I already decided it will be my next car. I don't need you making me second guess that now.

Please!

[robg]

Originally Posted by clyde

Would all shut up already about why this might not be an awesome car?

I already decided it will be my next car. I don't need you making me second guess that now.

Please!

Ha - I am fully in the it’s awesome camp!


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[JST]

Drove a 4S sedan. Dealer suggested SportTurismos wouldn't be here 'til August, but who knows...maybe he was just trying to sell me the car we were in.

It's an impressive car, no doubt. You wouldn't know it was electric, which I mean in both very positive and somewhat less positive ways; its default programming is to creep like an ICE auto (I didn't really explore whether you could turn that off), and there's essentially no regen on lift-off the way there is with a Tesla, so it just feels like an auto.

It makes fake noises outside and also inside, though you can shut the latter off.

And you can feel the transmission shift, too, though it's quite smooth and obviously there are only two speeds.

Put it all together and it feels like...a Panamera, honestly.

It's very fast but not as hair trigger (and, truth be told, not as fast) as a Model 3. Feels more deliberate in terms of engaging the speed.

Handling is top notch compared to the Tesla, and the ride is firmer but better damped.

Compared to the Model 3, it's a lot bigger car outside. Not sure if there's much more space inside, though probably it's wider.

The interior fit and finish and materials quality is leagues better than the Tesla, though for whatever reason Porsche has decided to abandon buttons mostly too so you end up with a lot of non-haptic touch surfaces. Easier to use than the Tesla because there are so many of them, but not really that much better.

I like it a lot, but...one of the things that is most refreshing about driving the Tesla is the connectedness that comes from having strong regen and no creep. Feels very different from a traditional automatic. The Taycan, in aping the feel of an ICE, will be a very smooth transition for people that drive traditional automatics, but at the same time it doesn't particularly commend itself over any other automatic, from a driving experience standpoint.

Getting back into my ancient Porsche on the way home, running it up through the gears, it was clear to me just how hard it is going to be to build a real electric sports car.

[wdc330i]

Originally Posted by JST

Drove a 4S sedan. Dealer suggested SportTurismos wouldn't be here 'til August, but who knows...maybe he was just trying to sell me the car we were in.

It's an impressive car, no doubt. You wouldn't know it was electric, which I mean in both very positive and somewhat less positive ways; its default programming is to creep like an ICE auto (I didn't really explore whether you could turn that off), and there's essentially no regen on lift-off the way there is with a Tesla, so it just feels like an auto.

It makes fake noises outside and also inside, though you can shut the latter off.

And you can feel the transmission shift, too, though it's quite smooth and obviously there are only two speeds.

Put it all together and it feels like...a Panamera, honestly.

It's very fast but not as hair trigger (and, truth be told, not as fast) as a Model 3. Feels more deliberate in terms of engaging the speed.

Handling is top notch compared to the Tesla, and the ride is firmer but better damped.

Compared to the Model 3, it's a lot bigger car outside. Not sure if there's much more space inside, though probably it's wider.

The interior fit and finish and materials quality is leagues better than the Tesla, though for whatever reason Porsche has decided to abandon buttons mostly too so you end up with a lot of non-haptic touch surfaces. Easier to use than the Tesla because there are so many of them, but not really that much better.

I like it a lot, but...one of the things that is most refreshing about driving the Tesla is the connectedness that comes from having strong regen and no creep. Feels very different from a traditional automatic. The Taycan, in aping the feel of an ICE, will be a very smooth transition for people that drive traditional automatics, but at the same time it doesn't particularly commend itself over any other automatic, from a driving experience standpoint.

Getting back into my ancient Porsche on the way home, running it up through the gears, it was clear to me just how hard it is going to be to build a real electric sports car.

Interesting. Thanks for the write-up. Sounds like you have the best of both worlds right now, until Tesla and Porsche converge sometime in the future...

[clyde]

Originally Posted by JST

it was clear to me just how hard it is going to be to build a real electric sports car.

I don't believe this, at least not any harder than it is to build an ICE sports car.

What's going to be difficult, I think, is to accept (appreciate?) an electric sports car for what it is.

Or is there something intrinsic in the sum of the sights, sounds, smell, and feel of an ICE powered car with four or more forward gears that is so wholly unique that an electric powered car won't ever provide a compelling alternative?

I think the bigger challenge will be proving there's enough of a market for such a car that someone commits to building one.

[robg]

Originally Posted by JST

Drove a 4S sedan. Dealer suggested SportTurismos wouldn't be here 'til August, but who knows...maybe he was just trying to sell me the car we were in.

It's an impressive car, no doubt. You wouldn't know it was electric, which I mean in both very positive and somewhat less positive ways; its default programming is to creep like an ICE auto (I didn't really explore whether you could turn that off), and there's essentially no regen on lift-off the way there is with a Tesla, so it just feels like an auto.

It makes fake noises outside and also inside, though you can shut the latter off.

And you can feel the transmission shift, too, though it's quite smooth and obviously there are only two speeds.

Put it all together and it feels like...a Panamera, honestly.

It's very fast but not as hair trigger (and, truth be told, not as fast) as a Model 3. Feels more deliberate in terms of engaging the speed.

Handling is top notch compared to the Tesla, and the ride is firmer but better damped.

Compared to the Model 3, it's a lot bigger car outside. Not sure if there's much more space inside, though probably it's wider.

The interior fit and finish and materials quality is leagues better than the Tesla, though for whatever reason Porsche has decided to abandon buttons mostly too so you end up with a lot of non-haptic touch surfaces. Easier to use than the Tesla because there are so many of them, but not really that much better.

I like it a lot, but...one of the things that is most refreshing about driving the Tesla is the connectedness that comes from having strong regen and no creep. Feels very different from a traditional automatic. The Taycan, in aping the feel of an ICE, will be a very smooth transition for people that drive traditional automatics, but at the same time it doesn't particularly commend itself over any other automatic, from a driving experience standpoint.

Getting back into my ancient Porsche on the way home, running it up through the gears, it was clear to me just how hard it is going to be to build a real electric sports car.

THanks for the review. I assume you got to take it out without a salesman in the right seat due to COVID? I wonder if Porsche will ever backdown from their no lift-off regen approach-- would be an easy thing to change via software but the Germans can be stubborn. I dont really see the harm in making it a user selectable setting. I think they may be right that its actually more efficient to only incorporate regen when you deliberately brake but they of all automakers should understand that lift off regen simulates the feel of being in a lower gear in a manual trans. It also baffles me that they removed the "track forward" button on the wheel in favor of a regen setting shortcut when they already have a much better solution in their parts bin: paddles.

[JST]

Surprisingly the salesman rode along. It was a nice day so with the masks and the open windows I wasn’t terribly concerned.

[wdc330i]

Of all my test drives last fall, Porsche was the only dealership that insisted upon riding along. And I had already bought a car from this particular dealership.