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Old 12-30-2018, 10:22 AM   #21
AF
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Originally Posted by Nick M3 View Post
You guys should hire clyde to negotiate your car purchases for you!
Lol ... I’m sure he would do better than me for sure ... how he only paid $19k for his Camaro still blows my mind.
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Old 12-30-2018, 01:44 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by clyde View Post
Truecar is worthwhile as a source, but they're far from a final word. They exist to generate sales leads and that's how they make their money. Many of the places with price info get theirs from Truecar these days (not sure if USAA is one of them).

I suspect there's at least one good Mazda or Mazda 3 forum with reasonable recent pricing info out there and you can get all the info you need from it in 15 minutes or less. Another 15-30 minutes browsing inventory on cargurus.com (seriously, check cargurus.com out), mazdausa.com and local dealer sites should give you an idea of what incentives are available (and which ones you may qualify for).

After that, you ought to have a pretty good idea what a fair price is. Not a grind it out price, but a fair price.

I would suggest going the online route and do the bulk of your negotiating by email starting with the online quote request form on specific cars at a variety of dealers. The initial quote request is BS, but when they contact you in repsonse, you tell them what you want, you want to buy soon (that day if the hour makes it possible), and be demandingly firm that they break their quote out for car price, incentives, rebates, doc fees and state fees (taxes, title, reg, etc).

In the offer- counter-offer process, stay below your target price initially and let them come to you. If your target is reasonable and in the "fair price" range, it shouldn't take more than a handful of emails. Then, pick up the phone.

OTOH, when you know the price you're looking for, you can just walk in somewhere, but you're betting your time that it will work out at that dealer at that time. And it can. But if it doesn't, you've wasted a lot of time.

It sounds so much more complicated than it is and it's not a grind. You just need to know what you want to pay. Don't play the "out the door" game. Negotiate the price of the car separate of incentives, rebates, fees, taxes, and everything else. All that stuff will be what they're going to be. The price of the car is the about the only thing that can vary. Know what the other things are and use them in your mental calculations, but keep them out of the negotiation process.

The one exception is if there is any manufacturer to dealer incentives that the dealer chooses whether to use to close your sale. GM (or just Chevy?) had up to $4k "flex cash" available at the time I bought. The manufacturer was making $XXX available to each dealer for the month. Up to $4k could be used on any one vehicle, but once the full $XXX was used, they had no more for any vehicles for the rest of the month. Some dealers applied a little to each car, some put a lot on their hard to sell cars and would not put anything on their fast movers. When I was negotiating, some offered to use up to $3k, most $2k or less. The one I bought from used all $4k.

Remember that dealers and manufacturers built the system to get you to part with as much money possible. It doesn't take a lot of effort to find a fair and reasonable price. Decent dealers will get you to that price pretty quickly...you just need to know what it is first.

Good luck!
I really need to hire clyde to get my Miata sometime ....

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Old 12-30-2018, 02:40 PM   #23
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It's not hard. You just need to know your numbers and target car before you set foot in the showroom, and then be prepared to walk away if you don't get close to where you want to be. It also helps to remember that the salesperson is only pretending to be your best friend ever, and will forget your name the moment you take delivery and leave the dealership. Stand tall and confident, and remember that it's your money. Keep as much of it as you can.
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Old 12-31-2018, 10:35 AM   #24
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Sorry ff but that just isn’t the method I like to use to buy a car. I look at it more for the long term relationship with the saleperson and the dealer.

I still talk to one of my BMW salesman who no longer works in the car business, I consider him a friend and he is a great guy ... when I go to Audi I get a hug from my sales woman and we talk about cars.

My Mercedes salesman just retired and moved out of state and we still talk as well. He is a really nice guy and i’m glad he is enjoying his retirement.

I also get very good service plus sometimes I get something out of the norm like the time the bmw dealer gave me an i8 for the weekend or more recently so the Audi dealer gave me the keys to an S4 so I could take it by myself for an extended test drive. I know this might happen in other states but here in NY they don’t give you the cars by themselves.

Anyway I know your method works for some but I just want to buy my new car, enjoy the experience and get a reasonable deal.
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Old 12-31-2018, 12:13 PM   #25
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yeah but you buy like 3 cars a year, every year

Quote:
Originally Posted by AF View Post
Anyway I know your method works for some but I just want to buy my new car, enjoy the experience and get a reasonable deal.
no wonder your sales people give you big hugs when they see you walk in
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Old 12-31-2018, 12:21 PM   #26
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yeah but you buy like 3 cars a year, every year



no wonder your sales people give you big hugs when they see you walk in
Yeah.
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Old 12-31-2018, 01:54 PM   #27
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I'm with AF. I do my research such that I won't be screwed, but then I make a decent offer such that they don't feel screwed either. I'm not in it to win at all costs.
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Old 12-31-2018, 03:33 PM   #28
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I wouldn't worry about the dealership feeling screwed. They won't extend the same courtesy towards you. And they won't progress any further downwards in negotiations if it doesn't make sense for them.

Just like the buyer should, the dealership enters negotiations knowing what their $$ numbers need to be.

Of course, your time is valuable too. I would never spend hours haggling over something like $200. To me that seems silly, and at that point it's probably more of a chest-beating exercise. If I can't get to where I want to be in the deal within ~20 minutes, then it wasn't meant to be.
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Old 12-31-2018, 05:13 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ff View Post
I wouldn't worry about the dealership feeling screwed. They won't extend the same courtesy towards you. And they won't progress any further downwards in negotiations if it doesn't make sense for them.

Just like the buyer should, the dealership enters negotiations knowing what their $$ numbers need to be.

Of course, your time is valuable too. I would never spend hours haggling over something like $200. To me that seems silly, and at that point it's probably more of a chest-beating exercise. If I can't get to where I want to be in the deal within ~20 minutes, then it wasn't meant to be.
I think it's also a lot different buying a basic car versus a BMW. There are a lot more smarmy tricks at Honda dealers and such. At least that was my experience the three times I and my family bought Hondas.

I always find the least smarmy customer rep at BMW or whatever, and then take the deal to email only. I never cement anything in person. I need to be able to take my time, do my calculations, research, etc. without any external pressure.
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Old 12-31-2018, 08:48 PM   #30
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Any supplier discounts from work? That usually helps a lot too.
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