Dial 911

[robg]

Originally Posted by wdc330i

Agreed. They have not succumbed to the big beaver grin, which is great. I have such mixed feelings about BMW—now the small grilles look dated and the big grilles look cheesy. There is no happy medium.

Yet, I still prefer their overall package of BMW (Porsche out of consideration for me because $$$) to other cars out there.

Yeah-- BMW really nails it when it comes to balancing price/practicality/features/power in the segments in which they compete. Whenever I consider alternatives to a given BMW, it really shines a light on how much emotion is involved in a car purchase (especially at this price level). For me, (to be totally honest) much of that emotional connection comes from how much I like or dislike the styling. But my practical side slams on the brakes when I'm confronted with, say, the absurdity of paying 100k for a RWD taycan vs 75k for an i4 50 (for example). Or, to take another example, a new Range Rover Sport would cost me about 10-20k more than a similar x5). When compared to Audi, the pricing is obviously closer but Audis tend to be technically inferior to their BMW competitors (think etron SUV vs iX, Q7 vs X7, S5 vs 4 series, etc)...

Sometimes new BMW styling trends grown on me over time, so I guess we'll see. Right now, the existence of a technically superior and/or cheaper BMW product serves to make me really question whether I want one of the alternatives. I guess its a good thing cause it prevents me from spending $$$. It has also led me to considering some pretty niche oddball choices recently such as a Jaguar i-pace or A6 Allroad!

When it comes to sports cars, however, it's easier to justify the Porsche premium because they are pretty unique in some cases.

[lemming]

I know a 911 is totally superfluous. And probably not even the best sports car made.

But I’d say I’ve never regretted spending the money. Every time I drive one of the Porsches, it feels special. And it’s been equally true of the Mercs. I can’t say this for most anything else I’ve owned and it’s over 50 different cars now.

It is overpriced. But honestly everything is. It’s just the scale of it is absurd.

[robg]

Originally Posted by lemming

I know a 911 is totally superfluous. And probably not even the best sports car made.

But I’d say I’ve never regretted spending the money. Every time I drive one of the Porsches, it feels special. And it’s been equally true of the Mercs. I can’t say this for most anything else I’ve owned and it’s over 50 different cars now.

It is overpriced. But honestly everything is. It’s just the scale of it is absurd.

For fun, I went to a used car dealer today that specializes in Porsches (mostly 911s actually) and got a chance to sit in pretty much every generation of water cooled from a 996 turbo, 997.2, 991.1 and .2 and a 992. They even had a 996 GT3!

A couple observations:
-Almost every 991 had this annoying creak from the center console lid if you pressed on it.
-14 way seats are a must have for me. They feel so comfortable and I didnt like how the base seats dont let you adjust the tilt of the seat (you can just raise or lower). 18 ways and buckets were too tight.
-The 996 turbo kind of charmed me. In some ways, I even preferred the interior to the 997s...this one had full leather which probably helped. This one had about 33k miles and the x50 pack.
-The 992s had this annoying creak from the door handle (tried this in a couple of them). Pretty crap considering the price of the car. Maybe they've fixed that (these were 2020 cars). The PDK "shaver" shifter is pretty silly, and the gloss black on the center console sucks.
-Overall, I think I still like the 991.2 best overall but the ones they had were over 100k for a manual. 80k for a 2017 pdk.

[lemming]

Originally Posted by robg

For fun, I went to a used car dealer today that specializes in Porsches (mostly 911s actually) and got a chance to sit in pretty much every generation of water cooled from a 996 turbo, 997.2, 991.1 and .2 and a 992. They even had a 996 GT3!

A couple observations:
-Almost every 991 had this annoying creak from the center console lid if you pressed on it.
-14 way seats are a must have for me. They feel so comfortable and I didnt like how the base seats dont let you adjust the tilt of the seat (you can just raise or lower). 18 ways and buckets were too tight.
-The 996 turbo kind of charmed me. In some ways, I even preferred the interior to the 997s...this one had full leather which probably helped. This one had about 33k miles and the x50 pack.
-The 992s had this annoying creak from the door handle (tried this in a couple of them). Pretty crap considering the price of the car. Maybe they've fixed that (these were 2020 cars). The PDK "shaver" shifter is pretty silly, and the gloss black on the center console sucks.
-Overall, I think I still like the 991.2 best overall but the ones they had were over 100k for a manual. 80k for a 2017 pdk.

I’m surprised at the 991.2 pricing still being what it is.

I didn’t mind the 996TT interior. It is functional and I’d be fine with it even today. The extended leather option in the 996 probably makes a difference. As it does for any recent 911. Thr interior of the 991.2 Turbo S is amazing. The base interior of the 911 T is probably pretty awful for a 112k car.

I don’t know what you mean about creaking console but I’ll test for it next time I’m in a 991.2.

I do not like the 992 interior. Too much shiny piano black surface to replace buttons. And I prefer analog gauges.

[lemming]

In other news, I’m on calendar for the entry level 992 GT3 course at PDE in LA. There is a 2nd class with telemetry. And then there are two other options to ponder, the Academy which is $6500 for multiple classes over 60 days and finally the bring your car to PDE for $500 a session which seems okay but meh to me. Cheaper ways to get to the track in SoCal with Speed Ventures, etc.

[JST]

The 996/986 interiors really have not grown on me. The exterior styling of the base 996 has a bit, but the interiors are just so specific to that period that I really can’t appreciate them.

The 997s remain excellent, in my mind. The 991/982 is good, though I don’t particularly like the infotainment system and the lack of hard coded radio presets.

Agree with lemming that the 992 has too much glass. Also the cup holder is weird.

[SCA]

2006 911 Carrera S, Manual, Speed Yellow, under 10k miles, $57k https://mart.pca.org/ads/61529

I like it! It is unfortunate the reputation associated with early 997 dot ones though. IMS and bore scoring. Of course bore scoring has been found on dot twos as well. The 3.8 appears to be more prone to it than the 3.6.

I pulled my 997.2 out of hibernation late yesterday afternoon and drove around for over an hour. I added a whooping 31 miles. The drive was not as enjoyable as I had hoped. It was simply far too windy and at speeds of 60+ the car simply was not happy, unstable. I did pass a 997.1 Cab with the top down at one point and the owner appeared to be enjoying his drive far more than me.

Edit: I totally agree with JST regarding the 996/986 interiors. I also feel they aged horribly.

The 992.2 dash is probably going to turn off a lot of the loyal 911 owners. Full glass cockpit coming.

Edit #2: I quickly realized that I may prefer the standard center caps on 19” Carrera Classics than the recently installed color crest center caps. The silver paint is not a match to the wheels either. I had noticed that when looking at pics of other 997s. Oh well… maybe they will grow on me? Time will tell.

[JST]

That’s a neat car. IMS shouldn’t be an issue with a 2006. Would be a great candidate for retrofitting the new Classic PCM Plus.

[SCA]

Originally Posted by JST

That’s a neat car. IMS shouldn’t be an issue with a 2006. Would be a great candidate for retrofitting the new Classic PCM Plus.

I think it would depend when production was? My intel is from Rennlist. The bore scoring is unavoidable, but given the mileage it should not be an issue.

[robg]

Originally Posted by lemming

I’m surprised at the 991.2 pricing still being what it is.

I didn’t mind the 996TT interior. It is functional and I’d be fine with it even today. The extended leather option in the 996 probably makes a difference. As it does for any recent 911. Thr interior of the 991.2 Turbo S is amazing. The base interior of the 911 T is probably pretty awful for a 112k car.

I don’t know what you mean about creaking console but I’ll test for it next time I’m in a 991.2.

I do not like the 992 interior. Too much shiny piano black surface to replace buttons. And I prefer analog gauges.

Yeah- I get the sense that this dealer asks "all the money" for their cars so the pricing is probably on the high end. For example, they had a manual 997.2 for 80k -- and it had 5 previous owners!

They actually did have a Carrera T-- very strange spec considering it had a base interior, rear seat delete but had PDK. White w/ the silly side graphic. Anyway, yeah, the base interior did feel pretty underwhelming. If the intent was to spec out a "drivers car" I'm not sure why the original owner would've optioned PDK...

Also forgot - they had a 50th anniversary 991.1. I happen to love these...even had the cool houndstooth cloth seats. No way would i ever pay 130kish for one though. But just from a looks perspective it was my favorite car that I saw.