V50 & V70

Stopped at the Volvo dealer and checked out the V50 and V70s. Not bad. I'm thinking an all wheel drive wagon may be in my future. It'll haul people and gear and it's not an SUV

[TD]

We will likely be getting a V70R within the next 6 mos or so.

AWD, 300hp, 6-spd manual, 4-pot Brembos, 0-60 in 5.4, built-in booster seats and an available (old-school) rear-facing third row seat.

The perfect family wagon.

[clyde]

If you can't live with FWD in the SAAB, what makes you think it will be tolerable in an AWD Volvo? Isn't the nominal torque split 95/5 F/R in the V70R? That sounds like FWD dynamics to me until they start spinning. The Haldex system is cool and supposed to work quite well, but until it's doing something it's just sitting there.

Or do I not know enough about the V70R?

[TD]

Well, from our POV, we want something that could haul 4 kids in a pinch. Or 4 adults and 2 kids. Basically, we want a thrid row.

Getting a third row in something reasonably performance-oriented which can also be had with a manual tranny severely limits your choices.

As since the suspension is MUCH better than the Saab and any front power bias will still be better than the torque-steer fest we have now, I still view the Volvo's residual shortcomings as improvements over what we have now.

[blee]

Originally Posted by clyde

If you can't live with FWD in the SAAB, what makes you think it will be tolerable in an AWD Volvo? Isn't the nominal torque split 95/5 F/R in the V70R? That sounds like FWD dynamics to me until they start spinning. The Haldex system is cool and supposed to work quite well, but until it's doing something it's just sitting there.

Or do I not know enough about the V70R?

Imwithstupid. Here's a quote from C&D's review:

The Haldex computer-operated wet-clutch pack on the rear diff splits the torque 90/10 until it detects wheel slip or the driver stomps the throttle, at which point rear-axle torque ramps upward.

http://www.caranddriver.com/article....rticle_id=1794

[clyde]

Originally Posted by TD

I still view the Volvo's residual shortcomings as improvements over what we have now.

An improvement, I can see.

But is this is what I was thinking of.

[JST]

Originally Posted by clyde

If you can't live with FWD in the SAAB, what makes you think it will be tolerable in an AWD Volvo? Isn't the nominal torque split 95/5 F/R in the V70R? That sounds like FWD dynamics to me until they start spinning. The Haldex system is cool and supposed to work quite well, but until it's doing something it's just sitting there.

Or do I not know enough about the V70R?

The Haldex is not as much fun as the Subie split, but frankly it's invisible in day-to-day driving. My parents AWD wagons, the S60R that TD and I drove, and the R32 all display a complete absence of torque steer, and seamless rapid transfer of power to the rear when necessary. It is a substantial improvement over a FWD setup, though not as good as either 50:50 or 0:100.

The advantage of the Haldex, of course, is that you should get better gas mileage.

I need to drive a V50 T5.

I drove a 9-3 V6 Aero yesterday. Nice enough. Very Saab-like. Power in 1st was nothing to write home about. Power in 2nd and 3rd was much better. The interior is nice, other than the stupid steering wheel.

The WRX is more fun.

[rumatt]

Remind me again why you care about a powerful engine and torque steer in a family wagon?

IMO Your best options are:

1) Keep the saab, and deal with that fact that you can't carry 6 people. You can rent them an extra car 3 times a year and still save a shit load relative to swapping cars.

2) Is Mrs. TD the one with all of these restrictions, or is it you? If it's you, then get something cheap, reliable, and FWD, and suck it up when you need to drive it. Hell, it can even be a slushie. Driving something with "normal" power and automatic is a good reminder of how the other half lives. Oh, and you live in the south You don't need AWD. (:stickpoke )

Use the money you save to pay for your next car swap so you get something you really like for your daily driver.

[dan]

you can get a great deal on a used but fairly new Tahoe or Suburban these days

[TD]

Originally Posted by rumatt

Remind me again why you care about a powerful engine and torque steer in a family wagon?

IMO Your best options are:

1) Keep the saab, and deal with that fact that you can't carry 6 people. You can rent them an extra car 3 times a year and still save a shit load relative to swapping cars.

2) Is Mrs. TD the one with all of these restrictions, or is it you? If it's you, then get something cheap, reliable, and FWD, and suck it up when you need to drive it. Hell, it can even be a slushie. Driving something with "normal" power and automatic is a good reminder of how the other half lives. Oh, and you live in the south You don't need AWD. (:stickpoke )

Use the money you save to pay for your next car swap so you get something you really like for your daily driver.

The extra room is for neighbor kids or my parents. It is often that we would like to add either but can't.

It's not a 3x a year thing.

Why do we care: Because we both appreciate good driving feel. My wife, ideally, would like a 540iT 6-spd, with a third row. The major obstacle to us getting rid of her convertible is that she loves how it drives. Steering, clutch, and shifter feel.

As for who's the problem: Neither of us will drive a slushie. She might even be slightly less flexible about it than I am. She and I are also equally annoyed by non-firm suspensions. Basically, neither one of us wants to drive a boring car.

But we have practical needs.

Let's say this- If my wife is seriously considering a ~$40K station wagon who's only benefit over a ~$30K version is more power, a manual tranny and stiff suspension (and AWD), clearly she has to value those things as well.