To those thinking about trying a .....

3LOU5 · 08-22-2006, 07:40 PM

foot-clutch, suicide shift bike.

It's not that difficult, really.

So my g/f and I visited her parents living in Strasburg, ND (Birthplace of Lawrence Welk). Her dad is building a bike that I plan on purchasing in the future. Off the top of my head, it's a rigid (of course) with Pan motor, a 4-speed transmission off of an old side hack, foot-clutch/suicide shift, springer front end, dual-front brakes (thank goodness), kick-start (ugh), complete with some engine noises we just can't quite figure out.

Needless to say, and in military parlance, it's not FMC or Fully Mission Capable.

So as he was trying to wrench on that bike some more, he gave me the keys to an old rigid he built many years ago.

That particular scoot has an old 1947(?) air-cooled Harley motor called a 4-5 (45 cubic inches, I believe) mated to 3-speed transmission, foot clutch/suicide shift, springer, Z-bars, no front brakes, sissy-bars....well, you get the picture. It's basically an old-school "rat bike".

When I told him if I could watch him shift the bike as he rode up and down the street (I've never ridden such a set-up), he replies, "What? How the hell are you going to learn that way? Just get on and I'll show you !"

Spoken like a tried and true biker, eh?

To make a long story short, it's really not that hard. The only thing that took a bit of getting used to is the foot clutch. It works the opposite of a car clutch in that to make it disengage you have to PRESS DOWN . (Old biker saying: "heel-toe, away you go").

That, and the........uh.........no front brake thing. But lucky for me, Strasburg is sleepy little town with little to no traffic.

Here is a pic of my g/f's dad, CEO and chief designer of the now-defunct High Desert Choppers. The first is with the "King of Customs" Arlen Ness, and the second is with me with the OCC (The Teutels) bike built for Snap-On Tools in the background.

John V · 08-23-2006, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3LOU5

To make a long story short, it's really not that hard. The only thing that took a bit of getting used to is the foot clutch. It works the opposite of a car clutch in that to make it disengage you have to PRESS DOWN . (Old biker saying: "heel-toe, away you go").

I'm confused. That's how my car's clutch works...

*dredmo* · 08-23-2006, 10:26 AM

Holy Shit !

I want to meet Arlen Ness lol! Bah, no fair.

I'm pretty jealous right about now. hell, I'm excited for you. And yeah, I'd imagine learning how to work it should be easy enough - especially if you practice it sort of like the MSF courses teach you to do.

i.e.

sit on the bike, put it in first and just feel how the gear pulls a bit, then practice shifting at very low speeds etc...

Anyways, put some pics of the bike you will be buying up here!!!

3LOU5 · 08-23-2006, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John V

I'm confused. That's how my car's clutch works...

I somehow knew that clutch engage/disengage terminology would confuse some. Hell, it even confused me when I typed it.

In a car, to make it go forward, you have to slowly let off the pedal (i.e. release or "pull" it in). However, in this particular rigid (and I don't really know if all suicide shifters are set up this way), I had to do the opposite and PUSH the pedal forwards to make the bike go.

(Remember, in a car, if you PUSH the clutch pedal, you ain't goin' nowhere).

[Please don't have me resort to crude drawings for further clarification]

blee · 08-23-2006, 10:12 PM

So the clutch is engaged when the pedal is pushed down on the bike. The clutch is DISengaged when the pedal is pushed down in a car.

3LOU5 · 08-23-2006, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dredmo

Holy Shit !

I want to meet Arlen Ness lol! Bah, no fair.

I'm pretty jealous right about now. hell, I'm excited for you. And yeah, I'd imagine learning how to work it should be easy enough - especially if you practice it sort of like the MSF courses teach you to do.

i.e.

sit on the bike, put it in first and just feel how the gear pulls a bit, then practice shifting at very low speeds etc...

Anyways, put some pics of the bike you will be buying up here!!!

dredmo, you really ought to make a trip to Sturgis one day. Meeting "The Man" (Arlen) and the other famous bike builders, as well as seeing all different sorts of bikes (and I mean there are A LOT, besides Harleys) is just worth the plane trip.

Hell, if you can take a few weeks off, grab a buddy and take a ride up there. You will be going through some gorgeous scenery.

Or, you can do what 99.9999% of the so-called "bikers" do up there: "Ride your bike to Trailer Week"

I really wanted to conquer my "fear" of suicide shifters, but after seeing an Asian girl ride one on Main Street in Sturgis (she was one of Keino's crew from the Indian Larry camp), I knew I could do it too. (Sounds chauvinistic, huh?)

The learning procedure was indeed scary......and fun. Once I got the hang of it, I couldn't wipe the smile off my face. The scary, heartbeat-skipping part was when I tried to engage the front binders only to find out that there was no right lever to pull.

You'd be surprise how hard it is to adjust to different controls after learning and riding for many years on a "conventional" bike.

The first pic is probably the oldest bike in the Rally. A 1914 Harley in immaculate condition. I was talking to the owner and he tells me he's had obscene offers for the bike, but since it has been in his family since 1916, he is reluctant to sell it (understandably).

The second is a chopped Honda that we named "The Spike Bike". I sure as hell wouldn't want to be involved in an accident while riding it.

John V · 08-24-2006, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3LOU5

In a car, to make it go forward, you have to slowly let off the pedal (i.e. release or "pull" it in). However, in this particular rigid (and I don't really know if all suicide shifters are set up this way), I had to do the opposite and PUSH the pedal forwards to make the bike go.

In your first post, you wrote disengaged when you meant engaged, but I get it now

.

So the clutch only stays engaged when you're pressing down on it? Does it have a spring to return it to the disengaged position? In other words, do you have to keep the clutch pressed all the time?

3LOU5 · 08-24-2006, 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John V

In your first post, you wrote disengaged when you meant engaged, but I get it now

.

So the clutch only stays engaged when you're pressing down on it? Does it have a spring to return it to the disengaged position? In other words, do you have to keep the clutch pressed all the time?

In this particular bike, the foot clutch lever looks somewhat like this (part #1):

http://www.jpcycles.com/catalog/2005...talog/0102.htm

There are springs, but they are not really "return" springs, per se. Once you depress the clutch forward to make the bike go, it remains there. To "disengage" the clutch, you have to push the "heel" part down, and again, once you push it down it stays there.

I should've taken a pic of the whole bike, but I was so excited I forgot my digicam in the house.

John V · 08-28-2006, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3LOU5

In this particular bike, the foot clutch lever looks somewhat like this (part #1):

http://www.jpcycles.com/catalog/2005...talog/0102.htm

There are springs, but they are not really "return" springs, per se. Once you depress the clutch forward to make the bike go, it remains there. To "disengage" the clutch, you have to push the "heel" part down, and again, once you push it down it stays there.

I should've taken a pic of the whole bike, but I was so excited I forgot my digicam in the house.

I can see now how that would be a bit intimidating.

I would be worried not about getting the bike going but rather getting it stopped and the clutch disengaged in a panic situation.

*dredmo* · 08-28-2006, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John V

I can see now how that would be a bit intimidating.

I would be worried not about getting the bike going but rather getting it stopped and the clutch disengaged in a panic situation.

From what I hear (no personal experience), what you say is true at first, but easily overcome after a bit of riding. What I hear is the worst thing is the fact that you have to take your hand off of the handlebar to downshift, and most panic situations require downshifting - now you're downshifting with one hand on the bars.

I'm no expert, but in a few conversations I've had about them, that has been the main concern.

Don't quote me.

08-22-2006, 07:40 PM	#1
3LOU5 Slacker Extraordinaire Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Reno, NV Posts: 3,719	To those thinking about trying a ..... foot-clutch, suicide shift bike. It's not that difficult, really. So my g/f and I visited her parents living in Strasburg, ND (Birthplace of Lawrence Welk). Her dad is building a bike that I plan on purchasing in the future. Off the top of my head, it's a rigid (of course) with Pan motor, a 4-speed transmission off of an old side hack, foot-clutch/suicide shift, springer front end, dual-front brakes (thank goodness), kick-start (ugh), complete with some engine noises we just can't quite figure out. Needless to say, and in military parlance, it's not FMC or Fully Mission Capable. So as he was trying to wrench on that bike some more, he gave me the keys to an old rigid he built many years ago. That particular scoot has an old 1947(?) air-cooled Harley motor called a 4-5 (45 cubic inches, I believe) mated to 3-speed transmission, foot clutch/suicide shift, springer, Z-bars, no front brakes, sissy-bars....well, you get the picture. It's basically an old-school "rat bike". When I told him if I could watch him shift the bike as he rode up and down the street (I've never ridden such a set-up), he replies, "What? How the hell are you going to learn that way? Just get on and I'll show you !" Spoken like a tried and true biker, eh? To make a long story short, it's really not that hard. The only thing that took a bit of getting used to is the foot clutch. It works the opposite of a car clutch in that to make it disengage you have to PRESS DOWN . (Old biker saying: "heel-toe, away you go"). That, and the........uh.........no front brake thing. But lucky for me, Strasburg is sleepy little town with little to no traffic. Here is a pic of my g/f's dad, CEO and chief designer of the now-defunct High Desert Choppers. The first is with the "King of Customs" Arlen Ness, and the second is with me with the OCC (The Teutels) bike built for Snap-On Tools in the background. Attached Thumbnails Last edited by 3LOU5; 08-22-2006 at 09:27 PM. Reason: correction

08-23-2006, 10:26 AM	#3
dredmo Chillaxin' Join Date: Oct 2003 Carmudgeonly Ride: '05 C50, '04 F-150 Location: CA Posts: 6,302	Holy Shit ! I want to meet Arlen Ness lol! Bah, no fair. I'm pretty jealous right about now. hell, I'm excited for you. And yeah, I'd imagine learning how to work it should be easy enough - especially if you practice it sort of like the MSF courses teach you to do. i.e. sit on the bike, put it in first and just feel how the gear pulls a bit, then practice shifting at very low speeds etc... Anyways, put some pics of the bike you will be buying up here!!!

08-23-2006, 10:12 PM	#5
blee Doctor Mudgeon Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 6,433	So the clutch is engaged when the pedal is pushed down on the bike. The clutch is DISengaged when the pedal is pushed down in a car.