Roundel compares Golf R and 328

[clyde]

Originally Posted by JST

Today's Civic should be compared to previous Accords, simply because the Fit exists.

Or, at least, the existence of the 1 and Fit tend to show the upward drift in market position of the 3 and Accord, respectively.

Or the 1 and the Fit show a desire of BMW and Honda to compete in more market segments than they did 20some years ago.

In 1990 BMW sold 3 model lines in the US? Today they have 12 (and where do you fit MINI in)? Not sure how //M fits in there, but whatever. Then you have the 2 vs 4 versions of the same models. And the GT variants and the M but not Ms and wagons or not, and, and, and...

In 1990, Honda sold 4 lines in the US (Civic, CRX, Prelude, Accord) not including 3 more Acura models. They sold 3 more models in other markets, of which you could nearly pick any one of them as e proper comparison point to the Fit...just not sold here. Today, Honda sells 8 models plus Acuras, some of which are kinda just badge engineered and some are their own cars. Like BMW, not sure how to cut them up.

In the face of needless complexity, reversion to simplicity works wonders. 3er is to 3er as Accord is to Accord. Both cars are intended to occupy the same market space serving the same purpose today as all those years ago: bread and butter mass market car providing the reference for the rest of their nameplate, where up or downmarket.

[IndyMike]

Originally Posted by SARAFIL

What really hurts the F30 are the new "lines"...

Since you mentioned lines I'm still having an issue with the hood and side body lines of the new 3 series. Both look really awkward to me.

Funny how things change over time. Whereas I used to find the E60 an outright turd, I now think the F10 is flat out beautiful and the best design and execution of form found in the 3-5-7 lineup. Just a shame it drives like a Buick now.

Whereas the F10 pulls it off nicely, the F30 just looks kind of scrunched up at the hood line and scrunched out over the body lines to me.

Looking forward to hopefully getting one as loaner when I get the Coupe tinted next month.

[SARAFIL]

Originally Posted by IndyMike

Since you mentioned lines I'm still having an issue with the hood and side body lines of the new 3 series. Both look really awkward to me.

Funny how things change over time. Whereas I used to find the E60 an outright turd, I now think the F10 is flat out beautiful and the best design and execution of form found in the 3-5-7 lineup. Just a shame it drives like a Buick now.

Whereas the F10 pulls it off nicely, the F30 just looks kind of scrunched up at the hood line and scrunched out over the body lines to me.

Looking forward to hopefully getting one as loaner when I get the Coupe tinted next month.

Didn't mean that kind of line, but good feedback regardless. Haha

[Nick M3]

Euro NCAP pedestrian safety requirements basically ruined all cars. Some have dealt with the extra 6" of hood height better than others (BMW, has probably been one of the worst - probably partly because they historically liked to keep the hood as low as possible), but that's why all new cars look so damned chunky.

[John V]

The F30 is ugly but it's a supermodel compared to the 1er.