tires for M3
 

Any thoughts on Michelin Pilot Supersport vs. 4S? 4S wasn't available in the right size until very recently. I've certainly read great things about the 4S...

Subscribed, as I have plenty of PSS but no 4S experience...

Just based on the TR review I'd say it's a no-brainer.

I've heard great things about the 4S. Can't go wrong. But I loved the PSS in the 997TT.

That sounds like the same review they gave the PSS a couple of years ago.

I mean the PSS is pretty old now, in tire terms--the set on my Boxster is from 2012 (which, jesus, means I probably need new tires, even though they've only got about 7500 miles on them).

Tire tech moves pretty quickly, so I guess it's not shocking there's something bigger and better now.

Cool - I'll get the 4S. The car actually has PS2s on it right now!

For daily driving, PS2 is not a favorite of mine at all. It is terrible in the cold, no better in the hot/dry, reminds me of the current P-zero that feels a generation old. So very likely, either Michelin will be a great improvement.

I think the PS4 vs. PSS debate is an open one unless I get direct experience or hear from those I trust. Just that time goes by, newer "must" be better is not enough for my subjective. PS2 was a generation (5-6 years?) newer than the PS.

While the PS2 recorded high g numbers in good conditions, came standard on many good cars (including my 06 Cayman S), I haven't had enough of a back to back between it and the PS (the V-design), the Goodyear F1 or a Potenza of some sort that it was clearly better. In fact, in the real world of the Northeast, in my view it was worse to those three in many ways in sub-optimal conditions.

That is why I approach the PS4 with suspicion until first hand or reliable second hand experience. Especially as the PSS is so stellar.

Yeah, the PS2s aren't good in the cold, though I will say it makes sliding the rear out very easy (wife not a fan).

To add on to the PS2 hate, wasn't the Carrera Gt that killed Walker on them? Albeit 9-year old ones.

They suck when worn or when not up to temperature. Sure, I get it, so do all performance tires, but in my experience, the worst two for unpredictable street usage have been the p-zero and the ps2. I bought my first Cayman in Sept 06. In Nov 06, the first day pulling out of my garage, I was getting sideways. And no, I wasn't doing a Mustang Cars'n'Coffee, the tire was just a bit binary. At 2.5years/16k miles, with plenty of tread left, the rears hardened up and I started getting unpredictable sideways again. All that in a car with high-200's torque, nothing like the CGT.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...sport-4s-test/

The above is a great review (though not enough comparison with the PSS).

To be fair, front-engined cars (or even rear-engined in my crazy view) are less sensitive to tires than mid-engined. When a boxster or cayman goes, there is very little warning. What is a pleasant little drifto in a RWD bmw can easily become a scary or embarassing twirl in a torquey 987/981.

Also a good review:

http://www.automobilemag.com/news/mi...t-super-sport/

They say there are PS4 (Europe-only) and PS4S. I'd make sure.

Time really flies. That's the year that I'd replaced the tires on the S2000 with PSSes. Just doesn't seem like that long ago, in my memory.

I recall the PSS being very good in the wet. But softer handling all around than the RE-050 tires that I replaced.

I can't see why you'd get the PSS instead of the PS4S.

The only question is whether you decide less grip is more fun. I'm actually really enjoying the PS A/S3+ on my E36, which has just the right amount of grip.

Damn! How old are those tires?!

I'm trying to figure it out - when were PS2s phased out? regardless, they are old!

They should have a date code on them. Four digits - first two are the week, second two are the year, so 0208 would be from January 2008 for example.

The PSS is about $40 cheaper per tire, so there's that. For people that don't regularly push their tires to the limits (group that zach may not fall into?)...

PSS will be older, and these are tires that don’t age well.

If he wants a cheaper tire that lasts longer, my alternate recommendation comes in to play.

Neither of those tires come in stock 996 turbo wheel sizes:irate:

I think that the Turbo wants more grip. Also, cold traction isn’t really a factor in SD.

On my 4th set of conti Etx DW”s. No help here but I do love them.

I liked the DW's on a 335xi, but they are a gentler tire and don't really compete with the PSS for feel and grip. Soft sidewalls, in my experience as in some Conti tires. They are decent in the wet.

It's not just the dates. Even with 6/32nds depth, my PS2's turned to hard plastic only 3 years from production (2 years on the car) in 16k miles of street driving.

I haven't seen the M3 in like 3 months - guess I should head over this weekend to check it out and will look at the tires while I'm there. :)

Maybe you can put it on bat and get 36k. =P

Ditto. Replaced the PSS on my 2 with the A/S 3+ and quite prefer them.

Lol, no. I do plan to have it repainted sometime in the next few years.

I'm tempted to do this next time I need tires on the e46.

Rear: 4707
Front: 1809

New tires go on today, and then we can discuss it again in another 10 years. :)

Are there any tires that exist that have a stiff sidewall / carcass but a lower-dry-traction compound? I thought the Conti Sport might be that tire? I have Conti DWs on the Boxster and they're fine, but they're still a bit squishy in corners which is not fitting with the character of the car. They do slide around nicely which is part of why I like them.

Old stock PSS? :p

re050 potenzas fit that billing. Not as grippy as PSS in the dry, still very good in the wet, strong b-stone sidewalls. P-zeros have better sidewalls than the dw's but are 'meh' in the wet and absolutely fall apart below 55F compared to PSS or re050. Both of those tires will have better driving feel compared to the DW. I don't think the DW suits the character of the porsche. It was fine on a 335xi. I'd consider it or the contisport on the 535i.

That said, PSS and likely the PS4S are better than either the p-zero or the b-stone. Why do you want reduced dry grip again? ;)

Because not enough power.

The answer is Miata.

The DWs suit the car fine. But I now have a beater that I use whenever it rains, so I don't strictly need the wet-road awesomeness of the DW.

I already have a car that has face-bending grip. I don't need one for the street because I can't use it anywhere. I'd rather have something that I can push a bit at sane speeds and work the balance of the car.

Conti DW's: I've had them on my E46 twice now (17" wheels) and I liked them. Good mix of comfort and decent but not ridiculous grip. So I also go them for the Cayman on 18" wheels (down from 19" stock) and I don't like them nearly as much. They don't feel like a good fit for the car. There's a noticeable loss in steering precision over the the 19" Potenza RE050A's. Of course, how much of that is the wheel size, I don't really know.

Michelin Pilot Super Sport XL: For the first time in my life I ponied up for Michelin PSS's for the E46 (again, on 17's). I wish I had stuck with the DW's. They are noticeably stiffer over bad roadsthan the DW's. It makes no sense for a car like this. I suppose they're grippier, but I didn't need more grip. It's not worth the loss in ride quality.


But even with the DW's, I don't get to the limits of grip in the Cayman without driving like an absolute maniac. JV you mentioned sliding around on them in the boxster. It must be your heavy convertible top motor and my lightweight aluminum doors making all the difference. :bustingup

I never liked super stiff tires on the E46. My theory is the scrub radius is all screwy on that chassis if you put any reasonable width wheel and tire on it and it just leads to the steering tugging around over every groove in the road. Making the E46 "sporty" is a fool's errand.

Maybe my calibration is off, when the Boxster arrived it had Goodyear somethingorother supercar tires on it, and I hated them. I went for the DWs because they were a known quantity. They're pretty low profile (19" wheels) so that certainly helps.

You saw how many traffic circles are in my area. It's not hard to exceed the limits of a tire around a traffic circle that tight.

Oh come on, let me pretend it's my pull strap door handles and cup holder delete that produces the magical grip.

FWIW the ride quality on the PSSs is way better than the PS2s, at least on my car.

I really liked S03s on my E46. But they did tramline like mofos.