Tire recommendations: street + autox rains

[rumatt]

My tire situation is pathetic. I have like a thousand wheels/tires in my garage, but they all are dead enough to be dangerous in rain.

I want to buy something that meets these criteria:

1) Fits on either 8" rims, or the dumbass staggered 330 7.5" fronts + 8.5" rears
2) Can serve as a not-too-sucky autox rain tire if needed.
3) Is OK for daily driving
4) Not too expensive

How about the Hankooks Andy used at nationals for a rain tire? Cheap at $119/tire. :dunno:

Ventus R-S2 Z212 Maximum grip ultra high performance. Z-speed rated.
235/40R17 XL 94Y DSB

[nate]

I like PS2s.

[rumatt]

I like PS2s.

For almost double the price of the Hankooks, I'd hope you like them. ;)

[nate]

For almost double the price of the Hankooks, I'd hope you like them. ;)

Yea, kinda pricey.

I don't know anything about the Hankooks, but they are without a doubt the best tires that I have ever driven on.

[rumatt]

I don't know anything about the Hankooks, but they are without a doubt the best tires that I have ever driven on.

:lol:

I know what you meant.

[John V]

I liked the Hankooks as street tires on Clyde's car. :dunno: about them in rain, however.

PS2s better be lined in gold, last for 60,000 miles and pull 1g on the skidpad for what Michelin charges. :ack:

[FC]

I liked the Hankooks as street tires on Clyde's car. :dunno: about them in rain, however.

PS2s better be lined in gold, last for 60,000 miles and pull 1g on the skidpad for what Michelin charges. :ack:

$1060 shipped for a set for the ZHP.:ack: Then I have to pay for mounting and balancing.:ack:

[John V]

Wow.

Edgeracing.com has the Hankooks in Boxster 18" sizes for $580. I wonder if the Michelins are twice as good. :shifty:

[BahnBaum]

The Hankooks worked fine as rain tires. At least on the e30.

Alex

[rautox]

The 'kooks worked great on the subie in the rain, too.

[clyde]

If I had to go with a street tire to act as a rain tire...the Hankooks are what I'd go with if the sizing worked. What I didn't like about the Hankook on the RX-8 was that because it was a little short compared to OE (225/40-18 vs 225/45-18), I racked up mileage about 3% faster than I should have. OTOH, having the speedo read a couple MPH high at highway speeds probably never hurt me.

The tires wore pretty nicely on the street. I put about 14k on them and they still have plenty of life left (and are going on the front of the Boxster as streets). One of them has a couple screws in it, though. They were quiet, ride nicely and have more than enough grip for the street. FWIW, this is the same set that I did the Evo Challenge school on back in 8/05. And they're cheap.

We only ran them in the wet once (Devens, Saturday), and the experience didn't give us the warm and fuzzies. I don't think that we were anywhere close to right on pressures, and I don't think we drove very well. Still, though, I'm not sure that we did the wrong thing running those tires.

[bren]

I thought you were an all-season guy? In that case I'd look at the Avon M550 or the Kumho ASX.

I'm happy with the Kumho SPT on the M3 and would definitely buy them again. I'll be able to give you a comparison between the SPT and the Avon M500 soon as I just ordered them for the vette since it already had 1 good one on the car :rolleyes:

FWIW, ST* guys seem to like the M550 and the SPT for rain use.

You should be able to fit a 245 all the way around right?

[FC]

Wow.

Edgeracing.com has the Hankooks in Boxster 18" sizes for $580. I wonder if the Michelins are twice as good. :shifty:

Dammit, now you are making me wonder yet again if I should order those instead. I haven't ordered them yet.

The only matching set in that site are the Toyo Prozes T1r. And the set is
Are THOSE any good?

They are $600 cheaper than PS2's for the set.

[rumatt]

The reason I don't buy super expensive tires is that I would feel inclined to get my money's worth out of them and use them right to the wear bars. Of course, once you're anywhere near the wear bars they suck ass in rain.

I'd rather get cheaper tires and replace them sooner. I'm probably safer that way.

[John V]

FC, I'm kind of kidding. I'm sure the PS2s are absolutely fantastic tires. I just can't honestly see myself buying a tire like that, because I would never feel like I got my money's worth out of them. Are they THAT much better in the wet? Are they THAT much quieter and that much longer lasting? :dunno:

I'm with Matt. I'd rather have fresh tires every couple years rather than try to get every last mile out of an expensive set.

To me it has come down to the Dunlop Direzza, the Kumho SPT, the Avon Tech M500 and the Hankook Z212. All of these tires have very good survey responses at Tire Rack (except the Hankook, which isn't sold there). Of those, the Hankook will probably last the least long, since it's molded with less tread depth and a stickier compound.

I have driven on the T1R and was not impressed. Very squirmy and wandery. Learic had them on her RX-8 and she didn't like them either.

[rumatt]

I thought you were an all-season guy?

I don't know what I am. :rolleyes2

I need to buy *something* to drive on this summer, so I'm thinking I might as well make it decent for autox rains too. Then again, the fedex lot is on a hill. How much standing water can there be?

I really hate the fact that it means I'd need to run staggered wheels. I might just put 225's on the four 7.5" M68's I have, and if I happen to run them in the rain, people can protest me. But in that case I guess I might as well just stick with the R-comps.

[John V]

FedEx can easily get wet enough to require treaded tires. The lot as a whole is sloped, but there are flat areas that can gather a lot of water.

[rautox]

It's actually a matter of how much running water there can be. I've had it running over the tops of my shoes more than once on that lot. It's ... weird.

[rumatt]

:ack:

Thanks guys. I'll think of something...

[bren]

I might just put 225's on....

I thought 245's all around fit on the e46?

[rumatt]

I thought 245's all around fit on the e46?

Oh, they do. Maybe I'll get them. But if they're mostly for daily driving and I'm jamming them on 7.5" wheels it's pretty silly. They look like this. :D


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[bren]

Just think of it as extra curb protection.

[nate]

Are they THAT much better in the wet? Are they THAT much quieter and that much longer lasting? :dunno:


Yes, they are.

[bren]

Yes, they are.

Compared to what? What else have you had?

[nate]

Oh, they do. Maybe I'll get them. But if they're mostly for daily driving and I'm jamming them on 7.5" wheels it's pretty silly. They look like this. :D



So, what? As long as it fits...

Unfortunately, I do not think 245s will fit up front without spacers.

Staggered tires suck. I have 235/40/17 on all 4 corners.

[nate]

Compared to what? What else have you had?

Besides the track tires, the 328Ci has seen the stock a/s, 1 set of Yoko ES100s, 2 sets of S-03s, and these PS2s. I have driven on many other tires, including the PS1s. The PS2s blow them all out of the water.

I think the shitty ES100s chilled my image of el cheapo performance tires...

[bren]

Besides the track tires, the 328Ci has seen the stock a/s, 1 set of Yoko ES100s, 2 sets of S-03s, and these PS2s. I have driven on many other tires, including the PS1s. The PS2s blow them all out of the water.

I think the shitty ES100s chilled my image of el cheapo performance tires...

So you are comparing them to crap ;)

[FC]

Thanks John. I guess I'll just pull the trigger on the PS2's. As I have said before, I don't put many miles on the 330i anymore, so these tires will still be in great shape when I sell the car in ~2 years.

[clyde]

That reminds me of what I really didn't like about the Hankooks...no rim protector. Running the narrow tires on the RX-8 wheels...you could hear adn feel it every time you set one down. When stacking, it was metal on metal. Of course, at one of the last tire changes, a wheel fell outside down and left a bunch of nicks in the wheel's finish.

[John V]

I think the shitty ES100s chilled my image of el cheapo performance tires...

So they're worth double the price of tires you haven't tried because they were better than tires that are known to be crappy? :confused:

[rumatt]

So they're worth double the price of tires you haven't tried because they were better than tires that are known to be crappy? :confused:

That does seem to be what he said. :ack:

[nate]

So they're worth double the price of tires you haven't tried because they were better than tires that are known to be crappy? :confused:

Have you tried PS2s? Do you believe that they are not?

Neither of us have perfect information. Prices are important. In the collective judgement of tire purchasers, PS2s are worth twice as much.

[John V]

I've driven on PS2s, but not on my car and not in the rain. They were reasonably grippy, but not the grippiest street tire available. As I understand it they are an excellent all-around tire: quiet, sticky, good in the wet, and reasonably long-lasting.

Are they worth twice the price of a tire that does two or three of those things as good (or better) and suffers a bit at one or two of those things? To me, no way. To you, maybe. With Michelins you pay a lot just for the name.

[rumatt]

You should be able to fit a 245 all the way around right?

I'm thinking of getting Kumho SPT's, but getting a staggered set. 225's up front, 245's in the rear.

My logic is:

- The wheels are already staggered (7.5/8.5) so I won't be rotating them anyway (damn staggered wheels again :irate: )
- Unless it's flooding I won't be using these tires in the rain. And if it's flooding, the 225's up front won't necessarily be so bad.
- Since they are 99% for street use, having 245's on 7.5" tires seems retarded.

Can anyone convince me this is a mistake?

[John V]

The steering feel is better with the narrower tire so that's what I would pick.

[bren]

Can anyone convince me this is a mistake?
I know better than to argue your logic. :p

[rumatt]

I know better than to argue your logic. :p


Good, because I just ordered.

* fingers in ears to avoid hearing anything bad about my decision *

[clyde]

Good, because I just ordered.

* fingers in ears to avoid hearing anything bad about my decision *
http://rx8club.com/showpost.php?p=1832101&postcount=81

click if you dare

[rumatt]

http://rx8club.com/showpost.php?p=1832101&postcount=81

click if you dare

That's GOOD news for me buying the Kumho SPT's, which is allowed.

[Pinecone]

Based on Tire Rack tests, of the tires they carry, the PS2s are the best maximum performance wet tire, followed closely by the Goodyear F! GS-D3.

The Yoko ADVAN Neova AD07 is also pretty good.

I did not look at lower performance tires, that may actually have better wet performance.

I ran Mike's PS2s at Summit on the track and was impressed with them as dry tires.