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View Full Version : E39 M5s are fast.


blee
12-15-2003, 03:39 PM
That is all.




...okay, that isn't all. A friend of mine purchased a 2001 M5, LeMans Blue with Modena/Caramel interior, under 11,000 miles. He bought it from a dealership in MA, so he spent the night at our place on his way home to Raleigh. Thankfully, the snow/rain didn't start until very late Saturday night, so I got to take it out for a spin.

Wowee. While the torque doesn't feel as powerful/sudden as a C5's, that's only because almost nothing will feel as torquey as a C5. I would characterize the M5's WOT acceleration as "brutally smooth." I can't believe how strong it is in any gear, at any RPM. Wheee! The car also handles quite well (as expected). The steering setup feels good but is not as pinpoint-accurate as one might want. It manages, like all contemporary M cars, to provide a very flat ride that is still somehow comfortable. Amazing.

Overall, especially when puttering around town, the car is VERY elegant and restrained. I've never driven a car quite that "nice." Everything feels substantial, and when you're nice to the gas pedal, it feels like any other midsize sedan. The weight only disappears when you mash it. And even when going crazy, the car seems to be very laid-back about its movements, like it really isn't trying. Like I said: Restraint.

I was dumbstruck by the interior materials and quality. Sure, the design is a little old, but the execution is FLAWLESS. Leather-covered dashboard, alcantara pillars and ceiling, electric thigh support, folding mirrors, high-quality wood trim, perfectly weighted controls. I couldn't find a single flaw because I never tried to use the cupholders. :D Rear seat room, despite what the numbers may say, certainly feels much larger than an E46's. More kneeroom, much more shoulder room, a little more headroom. And the nappa leather is miles above that Montana stuff.

Overall, I think it's one of the best sedans on the market today, new or used, and I would not hesitate to buy one if I were so monetarily equipped. But I would not replace my E30 M3 with it. My M3 is about as different as it can be from this M5, but the M5 is actually ideologically quite similar to the E28 M5. The owner plans to take his M5 to the track, and I think it'll do very well there with some upgraded brakes.

Two thumbs up. But you knew that already.

FC
12-15-2003, 04:00 PM
That is all.




...okay, that isn't all. A friend of mine purchased a 2001 M5, LeMans Blue with Modena/Caramel interior, under 11,000 miles. He bought it from a dealership in MA, so he spent the night at our place on his way home to Raleigh. Thankfully, the snow/rain didn't start until very late Saturday night, so I got to take it out for a spin.

Wowee. While the torque doesn't feel as powerful/sudden as a C5's, that's only because almost nothing will feel as torquey as a C5. I would characterize the M5's WOT acceleration as "brutally smooth." I can't believe how strong it is in any gear, at any RPM. Wheee! The car also handles quite well (as expected). The steering setup feels good but is not as pinpoint-accurate as one might want. It manages, like all contemporary M cars, to provide a very flat ride that is still somehow comfortable. Amazing.

Overall, especially when puttering around town, the car is VERY elegant and restrained. I've never driven a car quite that "nice." Everything feels substantial, and when you're nice to the gas pedal, it feels like any other midsize sedan. The weight only disappears when you mash it. And even when going crazy, the car seems to be very laid-back about its movements, like it really isn't trying. Like I said: Restraint.

I was dumbstruck by the interior materials and quality. Sure, the design is a little old, but the execution is FLAWLESS. Leather-covered dashboard, alcantara pillars and ceiling, electric thigh support, folding mirrors, high-quality wood trim, perfectly weighted controls. I couldn't find a single flaw because I never tried to use the cupholders. :D Rear seat room, despite what the numbers may say, certainly feels much larger than an E46's. More kneeroom, much more shoulder room, a little more headroom. And the nappa leather is miles above that Montana stuff.

Overall, I think it's one of the best sedans on the market today, new or used, and I would not hesitate to buy one if I were so monetarily equipped. But I would not replace my E30 M3 with it. My M3 is about as different as it can be from this M5, but the M5 is actually ideologically quite similar to the E28 M5. The owner plans to take his M5 to the track, and I think it'll do very well there with some upgraded brakes.

Two thumbs up. But you knew that already.

There are two LeMans blue M5's at work. Damn, I love that paint.

bren
12-15-2003, 06:00 PM
My wife has decided that she needs an E39 M5 :cool:

Maybe by the time we need a sedan they will be affordable :cry:

Mathew
12-15-2003, 08:15 PM
Yah they are

SCA
12-15-2003, 09:47 PM
My dream, pickup a 01 or 02 E39 M5 in 2006 - 2008. ;)

TD
12-15-2003, 09:57 PM
My dream, pickup a 01 or 02 E39 M5 in 2006 - 2008. ;)

That's my plan. Basically in that timeframe pick up either an '01-02 M5 or an '04-05 S4.

The HACK
12-15-2003, 10:21 PM
My dream, pickup a 01 or 02 E39 M5 in 2006 - 2008. ;)

That's my plan. Basically in that timeframe pick up either an '01-02 M5 or an '04-05 S4.

Ugh. Have you ever driven an E39 M5?

The recirculating ball steering would drive me crazy. If you think the overboosted crap on the early E46es were bad, you should try the E39 M5 steering. Sure, the power and handling more than makes up for that flaw, but man oh man if they could just fix that the car would be perfect.

Plaz
12-15-2003, 11:11 PM
My dream, pickup a 01 or 02 E39 M5 in 2006 - 2008. ;)

That's my plan. Basically in that timeframe pick up either an '01-02 M5 or an '04-05 S4.

Ugh. Have you ever driven an E39 M5?

The recirculating ball steering would drive me crazy. If you think the overboosted crap on the early E46es were bad, you should try the E39 M5 steering. Sure, the power and handling more than makes up for that flaw, but man oh man if they could just fix that the car would be perfect.

Worth noting that the E60 8-cyl. models do not have the recirculating ball achilles heel.

The HACK
12-16-2003, 12:12 AM
Granted, the E39 M5 is still one heck of a sedan...I would gladly give my left ball and a kidney to own one.

SCA
12-16-2003, 12:24 AM
My dream, pickup a 01 or 02 E39 M5 in 2006 - 2008. ;)

That's my plan. Basically in that timeframe pick up either an '01-02 M5 or an '04-05 S4.

I'd be all for a used 04-05 S4. :thumbup: I drove one last week. Woo Hoo!

TD
12-16-2003, 06:46 AM
My dream, pickup a 01 or 02 E39 M5 in 2006 - 2008. ;)

That's my plan. Basically in that timeframe pick up either an '01-02 M5 or an '04-05 S4.

I'd be all for a used 04-05 S4. :thumbup: I drove one last week. Woo Hoo!

Of course, those are my perceived candidated today. Although I know of nothing yet that might be coming out in the intervening years that I would think to add to the potential list. It'll probably come down to those two and my needs at the time.

It also means that I'm keeping the M3 at least another 3-4 years.

rost12
12-16-2003, 09:49 AM
Where's that smilie...oh, here it is:

:cool:

lemming
12-16-2003, 10:13 AM
My dream, pickup a 01 or 02 E39 M5 in 2006 - 2008. ;)

That's my plan. Basically in that timeframe pick up either an '01-02 M5 or an '04-05 S4.

I'd be all for a used 04-05 S4. :thumbup: I drove one last week. Woo Hoo!

Of course, those are my perceived candidated today. Although I know of nothing yet that might be coming out in the intervening years that I would think to add to the potential list. It'll probably come down to those two and my needs at the time.

It also means that I'm keeping the M3 at least another 3-4 years.

the e90 M3 with the v8 and aluminum intensive everything might change your mind and it mjay likely be at a similar pricepoint as a used M3 in about 3 years? okay, maybe not. but something to consider.

i'd love an excuse to NOT buy a porkchop if they execute the e90 m3 well --it's almost anti-snobbery to own an m3 as opposed to a porkchop. too much baggage goes with the 911 that i do not always appreciate. same with the STi. same garbage. same demographic giving me the attitude.

:lol:

same look when i give it back.

EDIT: f*ck. i meant used M5.

ARCHER
12-16-2003, 10:17 AM
I need to get friendly with an E39 M5 owner. A friend of my dad's drives a Dinan 540i - that thing is a rocket even with the slushie.

I too am trying to convince the wife that we should pick up a used M5 in a few years.

nate
12-16-2003, 12:24 PM
Ugh. Have you ever driven an E39 M5?

The recirculating ball steering would drive me crazy. If you think the overboosted crap on the early E46es were bad, you should try the E39 M5 steering. Sure, the power and handling more than makes up for that flaw, but man oh man if they could just fix that the car would be perfect.

It isn't great but it isn't nearly that bad.

The HACK
12-16-2003, 01:52 PM
It isn't great but it isn't nearly that bad.

I drove the M5 right after I drove Leif's MINI Cooper S and the difference was night and day. Very first thing I noticed that was sort of out of place on a car like this.

Maybe the MCS's steering feel is THAT good? :dunno:

lemming
12-16-2003, 02:10 PM
It isn't great but it isn't nearly that bad.

I drove the M5 right after I drove Leif's MINI Cooper S and the difference was night and day. Very first thing I noticed that was sort of out of place on a car like this.

Maybe the MCS's steering feel is THAT good? :dunno:

with all due respect to the people in this thread, i think, unfortunately as i would have to eat crow about this, that the 645Ci is a match/superior dynamically to the e39m5.

based on curb weight plus nurburgring time plus chassis technology, this is my extrapolation.

bren
12-16-2003, 02:24 PM
...i think...that the 645Ci is a match/superior dynamically to the e39m5.

based on curb weight plus nurburgring time plus chassis technology, this is my extrapolation.
Probably, but it is missing a couple of doors.

JST
12-16-2003, 03:11 PM
It isn't great but it isn't nearly that bad.

I drove the M5 right after I drove Leif's MINI Cooper S and the difference was night and day. Very first thing I noticed that was sort of out of place on a car like this.

Maybe the MCS's steering feel is THAT good? :dunno:

Driving an M5 back to back with a couple of E46 M3s on the same course convinced me that I have no real desire to own an M5. The M3 is just as fast and handles like a much smaller, lighter car. The steering feel is measurably superior. The M5 has more room and nicer details (and has two more doors), but it's not as much fun to drive. Even the extra torque (which is nice) is hampered somewhat by the extra weight and the wimpy clutch.

All of you guys who aren't satisfied with the E46 M3 *really* wouldn't be satisfied with the M5. The M5 is clearly a great sedan, but the only reason to buy one over the M3 is that you *really need* two more doors, and simply could not live with a two-door car. Otherwise, save yourself $20K and get the M3.

lemming
12-16-2003, 03:28 PM
It isn't great but it isn't nearly that bad.

I drove the M5 right after I drove Leif's MINI Cooper S and the difference was night and day. Very first thing I noticed that was sort of out of place on a car like this.

Maybe the MCS's steering feel is THAT good? :dunno:

Driving an M5 back to back with a couple of E46 M3s on the same course convinced me that I have no real desire to own an M5. The M3 is just as fast and handles like a much smaller, lighter car. The steering feel is measurably superior. The M5 has more room and nicer details (and has two more doors), but it's not as much fun to drive. Even the extra torque (which is nice) is hampered somewhat by the extra weight and the wimpy clutch.

All of you guys who aren't satisfied with the E46 M3 *really* wouldn't be satisfied with the M5. The M5 is clearly a great sedan, but the only reason to buy one over the M3 is that you *really need* two more doors, and simply could not live with a two-door car. Otherwise, save yourself $20K and get the M3.

could never have written it that well, JST. thanks.

clyde
12-16-2003, 05:30 PM
All of you guys who aren't satisfied with the E46 M3 *really* wouldn't be satisfied with the M5. The M5 is clearly a great sedan, but the only reason to buy one over the M3 is that you *really need* two more doors, and simply could not live with a two-door car. Otherwise, save yourself $20K and get the M3.

If my current situation allowed me to have an E39 M5 for daily driving and another car for autox, I suspect that I would be more than satisfied with the E39 M5. I really enjoyed the Q45 while I was driving it (aside from the multiple engine replacements). So long as I need one car to do everything, it won't cut it, though.

JST
12-16-2003, 07:59 PM
All of you guys who aren't satisfied with the E46 M3 *really* wouldn't be satisfied with the M5. The M5 is clearly a great sedan, but the only reason to buy one over the M3 is that you *really need* two more doors, and simply could not live with a two-door car. Otherwise, save yourself $20K and get the M3.

If my current situation allowed me to have an E39 M5 for daily driving and another car for autox, I suspect that I would be more than satisfied with the E39 M5. I really enjoyed the Q45 while I was driving it (aside from the multiple engine replacements). So long as I need one car to do everything, it won't cut it, though.

I'll reserve judgment until I drive one extensively on the street, but comparing the M5 to the M3 is sort of like comparing the M3 to...hmm...maybe an RX-8 with 100 extra hp? The M5 is bigger, heavier, slower-witted, and just not as much fun.

Honestly? Instead of an M5 I'd buy a G35 (which is more direct and offers more feedback) AND an Evo and pocket the extra 10 grand.

clyde
12-16-2003, 08:26 PM
I'll reserve judgment until I drive one extensively on the street, but comparing the M5 to the M3 is sort of like comparing the M3 to...hmm...maybe an RX-8 with 100 extra hp? The M5 is bigger, heavier, slower-witted, and just not as much fun.

Honestly? Instead of an M5 I'd buy a G35 (which is more direct and offers more feedback) AND an Evo and pocket the extra 10 grand.

That's just it...for a car that's only going to be used for commuting, errands, trips, etc...you know, a normal car, the M5 would be perfect. Tractable power is everything while size, weight, and dare I say it, feel just aren't all secondary.

blee
12-16-2003, 10:29 PM
I'd rather own an M5 than a G35 and an Evo. Neither car offers the polish and poise of the M5, and neither car offers the acceleration either. Roadholding and handling may be compromised slightly -- and I mean slightly. The catch is that I would not give up a car like my M3 for one. While technically superior in every way, I do not believe that it is as fun to drive. It has a character best suited for a daily driver family car, which is what it is...only with a BIG shot of ///adrenaline.

dan
12-16-2003, 10:50 PM
Maybe the MCS's steering feel is THAT good? :dunno:

it's pretty good :eek:

it's no Elise though :P

nate
12-16-2003, 11:31 PM
Honestly? Instead of an M5 I'd buy a G35 (which is more direct and offers more feedback) AND an Evo and pocket the extra 10 grand.The EVO better be pretty damn good, because the M5 offers much more feedback than the G35 and is a ton more fun to drive.

nate
12-16-2003, 11:33 PM
It isn't great but it isn't nearly that bad.

I drove the M5 right after I drove Leif's MINI Cooper S and the difference was night and day. Very first thing I noticed that was sort of out of place on a car like this.

Maybe the MCS's steering feel is THAT good? :dunno:

What do you expect?

The M5 is a huge car :dunno:

Never driven a Mini though, so I don't really know. It isn't any faster than my car though.

The M5 is a ton of fun though. Tons of power oversteer :awe: :paranoid: :cool:

TD
12-16-2003, 11:42 PM
Personally, I'd probably pick the S4 over it anyway.

Plaz
12-17-2003, 12:51 AM
Personally, I'd probably pick the S4 over it anyway.

I bet there's an alter ego of yours (meaning a different person, not a Holden) over on some Audi boards somewhere, who bought a new A4, sold it for the older model, and would probably pick the M5. :D

TD
12-17-2003, 06:37 AM
Personally, I'd probably pick the S4 over it anyway.

I bet there's an alter ego of yours (meaning a different person, not a Holden) over on some Audi boards somewhere, who bought a new A4, sold it for the older model, and would probably pick the M5. :D

My point was more that when it comes time to drop my, say, $30K in 3-4 years, would I rather get a 2 year old S4 or a 5 year old M5?

rost12
12-17-2003, 08:27 AM
[quote=JST]
The EVO better be pretty damn good, because the M5 offers much more feedback than the G35 and is a ton more fun to drive.

I got a ride in b'fest member's Evo8... My M5, handling wise, has nothing on that car... I wouldn't trade mine in, but boy :cool:

G35, though? Ph-lease.

lemming
12-17-2003, 11:50 AM
the evo8 is really sharp.

it's twitchy. twitchy in a good way, in other words, M coupes are twitchy in a bad way.

:P