View Full Version : GTI
clyde
02-11-2006, 05:41 PM
The more I read the more interested I get in the GTI. It just seems like a massively overweight smallish car.
I like the advertising campaign theme (lots of ads on the Olympics broadcasts).
http://www.projectfast.com/
The more I read the more interested I get in the GTI. It just seems like a massively overweight smallish car.
Since when is that a good thing?
rumatt
02-11-2006, 06:20 PM
Since when is that a good thing?
It's OK as long as it's FWD.
clyde
02-11-2006, 06:22 PM
Since when is that a good thing?
It's not a good thing. I didn't word that very well. I also forgot the part about it being ridculously over priced.
I think I'd be pretty happy commuting in the car if someone gave me one. i just couldn't bring myself to spend mid-upper $20s for it.
JST and I were underwhelmed by the GTI when we drove it. The A3 2.0T is much more fun to drive. And feel lighter. For not much more $$.
Jeff_DML
02-24-2006, 09:41 PM
they had 2 GTI's on the lot at my local dealer today. Cloth seats where killer, fit me like a glove, nice and supportive, leather one where even a bit more supportive. Steering wheel had a nice shape, definite dash stroker interior. didnt take it for a test drive, 2 door is a bit odd looking, I think the 4 or I gues 5 door will look better
I like the way it looks and I like the idea of the powertrain. Not too happy about the weight or the price, but I think it would still be fun to drive. And, like I've said before, I think the little fast guy is cute.
lemming
02-24-2006, 10:50 PM
those cars are really neat looking. the only angle that i do not like is the rear which looks too wimpy compared to the rest of the car. the rear looks like an A class or Aveo, man.
i parked right next to one at the grocery store and was pleasantly surprised to see a soccer marmish type open the hatch and put groceries in it.
she smiled broadly when i told her what a neat car i thought it was.
Jeff_DML
02-24-2006, 10:51 PM
yeah I agree the rear looks kind of funky/wimpy, hoping additional 2 doors will make it look better
Jeff_DML
02-24-2006, 10:59 PM
ok, couldnt find a pic with the same angle but I think the rear is better with 4 doors
http://www.vwvortex.com/gallery/albums//Volkswagen/Golf%20-%20GTI%20-%20Rabbit/Golf%20V/GTI%20-%20EU/004.jpg
vs
http://www.vwvortex.com/gallery/albums//Volkswagen/Golf%20-%20GTI%20-%20Rabbit/Golf%20V/GTI%20-%20EU/025.jpg
lemming
02-24-2006, 11:11 PM
i've always been a GTI fan, despite having owned the porkiest (an A3 vr6). the mark IV car never really resonated with me like this mark V does. VW recognized that, though, i think by paying extra attention to the GTI this time around and keeping a lid on the price and putting a really nice motor in it.
I think the rear is better with 4 doors
:+1
misterlance
02-26-2006, 02:22 AM
I think it is a very cool car. I am almost tempted to go test drive one, though I wont be in the market for a couple more years. Maybe an R32 version will happen in that time.
If the R32 is as crazily priced as the old one, it'll be a tough sell to me. Would probably be a fun car, though.
If the R32 is as crazily priced as the old one, it'll be a tough sell to me. Would probably be a fun car, though.
Yeah...but, I have to say, the 2.0T is a more fun engine than the 3.2 in the A3 (which is the same engine that the R32 used). A quattro 2.0, hotted up to about 250 hp with chip tuning, would be the ticket, and would be cheaper than an R32.
Will they build a quattro 2.0? Dunno. From what everyone says, any R3X for the US market would be an R36, which might be enough more lively than the 3.2 to make it worthwhile.
lemming
02-26-2006, 06:39 PM
Yeah...but, I have to say, the 2.0T is a more fun engine than the 3.2 in the A3 (which is the same engine that the R32 used). A quattro 2.0, hotted up to about 250 hp with chip tuning, would be the ticket, and would be cheaper than an R32.
Will they build a quattro 2.0? Dunno. From what everyone says, any R3X for the US market would be an R36, which might be enough more lively than the 3.2 to make it worthwhile.
it's fun to even think about how many neat cars one could buy (if they were in the market for a car) these days. it's getting better and the cars are darn fast, too, regardless of price.
i really want to get the GTI because i've always wanted to have one in the garage since childhood. just can't find a reason to own one. FWD will be enough to put me off for now --that and the price of one that i would buy (the R32 MarkV equivalent).
Jeff_DML
02-26-2006, 09:29 PM
previous generation R32 was a porker if I remeber correctly, somthing like 3600-3800 pounds. R36 or whatever will probably be even heavier. Also not a fan of the FWD default haldex, I want 50/50 min or more to the rear. I would just get the normal FWD GTi because for me it is just a fun nice commuter car that is decent in the twisties.
clyde
02-26-2006, 09:47 PM
From what everyone says, any R3X for the US market would be an R36, which might be enough more lively than the 3.2 to make it worthwhile.
But could it beat a proper RX-3? :eeps:
Jason C
02-26-2006, 09:51 PM
Source and mod on vortex:
Just got back from Germany and had a chance to drive the Golf V R32 over there. It is a great car, better handling and ride than the Golf IV R32, but not quite as visceral or raw feeling - a little more grown up. The car is a blast to drive and still makes great R32 noises just like the last car.
Right now it appears that the R36 is a ways off due to tranmission issues. VW is still working on newer 500 newton meter gearboxes that can handle the additional torque of a 300hp version of the 3.6l VR6. The main issue right now is that the 500 Nm gearbox is physically larger and may push the 3.6l VR6 to far forward in the engine bay to the point that it may not fit. So the overall development of the R36 will take longer (if it ever happens at this point).
In light of this new information, VW is talking about bringing the Golf V R32 to the U.S. market 2nd quarter of next year (2007). They are talking about 5,000 units and DSG only right now. Expect pricing to be in the low $30k range. We will not be getting the Recaro "racing shell" seats as there are major certification costs involved with occupancy detection devices and reworking the seat just for our regulations (the Audi RS4 uses a similar version of this seat and Audi didn't bring it over for the U.S. RS4 either).
Options and such are still being sorted out and I don't know if they plan on including Canada this time around. We'll watch this one carefully and let you know if anything else changes or develops.
- jamie
Source and mod on vortex:
If that's all true, scratch it off the list for future consideration.
The DSG-only thing is sort of expected and very dissapointing. The less viceral and raw thing kills it outright.
Jason C
02-26-2006, 10:00 PM
If that's all true, scratch it off the list for future consideration.
The DSG-only thing is sort of expected and very dissapointing. The less viceral and raw thing kills it outright.
Personally, I felt that the loss of the Euro-market seats is almost as regretable as the transmission choice.
http://www.vwvortex.com/gallery/albums//Volkswagen/Golf%20-%20GTI%20-%20Rabbit/Golf%20V/R32%20-%20EU/004.jpg
BahnBaum
02-26-2006, 10:05 PM
Those seats are haaawt.
Alex
Jason C
02-26-2006, 10:07 PM
Those seats are haaawt.
We get shafted on a lot of good stuff, check out the later DC2 Type-R seats (but hey, at least they brought ONE Type-R over to our country :rolleyes:).
lemming
02-26-2006, 10:09 PM
We get shafted on a lot of good stuff, check out the later DC2 Type-R seats (but hey, at least they brought ONE Type-R over to our country :rolleyes:).
it's trivial to install nice seats, however.
not something that can be said to discard with the DSG type transmission.
[am getting moneys and parts lists together to do both on 2 separate vehicles at the moment]
add'l thought: just based on looks alone (given the identical hardware), i can't see any reasons why someone would choose the a3 over the GTI.
Jason C
02-26-2006, 10:14 PM
it's trivial to install nice seats, however.
I heard the Recaro Shells are 3,000Euro options in France, so importing one my be prohibitive.
It's more of the attitude that bothers me. Sure, they can cite costs of certification, but why don't they amortize that change over 15,000 examples rather than 5,000? Then maybe we can get the cool seats AND a transmission choice. They know all this is going to end up in is the lovely *added market adjustments*.
lemming
02-26-2006, 10:16 PM
I heard the Recaro Shells are 3,000Euro options in France, so importing one my be prohibitive.
It's more of the attitude that bothers me. Sure, they can cite costs of certification, but why don't they amortize that change over 15,000 examples rather than 5,000? Then maybe we can get the cool seats AND a transmission choice. They know all this is going to end up in is the lovely *added market adjustments*.
if you're going to spend $35,000 on a Golf, would it really bother you to spend 3000Euro seats?
;)
Jason C
02-26-2006, 10:19 PM
if you're going to spend $35,000 on a Golf, would it really bother you to spend 3000Euro seats?
;)
$35k? After reading John's thread on VAG, I thing I'd rather get a 15 year old used Honda. ;)
lemming
02-26-2006, 10:30 PM
$35k? After reading John's thread on VAG, I thing I'd rather get a 15 year old used Honda. ;)
given that VAG has the highest fixed labor costs in Europe, plus inflation, plus the strength of the Euro plus the trend that a Passat 3.6 is priced at $38,000, i'm fully expecting the R3x Golf V to be all of $35,000.
not really sure if that car was worth the money for the R32 or if it'd be worth the money for the R36. all i know is that for the R32, a lot of people became apologists and had to make up a lot of subjective crap to make up for the fact that the car was dog slow.
at least the standard GTI is around $20k.
given that VAG has the highest fixed labor costs in Europe, plus inflation, plus the strength of the Euro plus the trend that a Passat 3.6 is priced at $38,000, i'm fully expecting the R3x Golf V to be all of $35,000.
not really sure if that car was worth the money for the R32 or if it'd be worth the money for the R36. all i know is that for the R32, a lot of people became apologists and had to make up a lot of subjective crap to make up for the fact that the car was dog slow.
at least the standard GTI is around $20k.
The R32 being discussed would be no different than the A3 3.2, at least as far as powertrain goes. That car wasn't that fun to drive.
lemming
02-27-2006, 07:57 PM
The R32 being discussed would be no different than the A3 3.2, at least as far as powertrain goes. That car wasn't that fun to drive.
forgive my ignorance, but is the a3 3.2 awd or fwd (or available in both)?
forgive my ignorance, but is the a3 3.2 awd or fwd (or available in both)?
A3 3.2 is Quattro only. And DSG only.
Which makes it just like the MkV R32, which is JST's point.
And he's right. It was rather boring to drive. Nothing like the MkIV R32.
misterlance
02-28-2006, 12:51 AM
The R32 may be pudgy but it was well made and has awesome resale value. Actually any year R32 is worth decent money.
Actually any year R32 is worth decent money.
Especially considering every R32 in the US was a 2004 model year car.
lemming
03-01-2006, 10:13 PM
The R32 may be pudgy but it was well made and has awesome resale value. Actually any year R32 is worth decent money.
the R32's value is only paper money. i'm happy that R32 owners are thrilled now. much like E46M3 values now which still appear to be decent, the car is in store for a nice corrective valuation when the R36 comes out (similarly the e90m3 will nicely depreciate the e46m3).
the R32's value is only paper money. i'm happy that R32 owners are thrilled now. much like E46M3 values now which still appear to be decent, the car is in store for a nice corrective valuation when the R36 comes out (similarly the e90m3 will nicely depreciate the e46m3).
I was actually taking a gentle shot at misterlance's post as he said "any year" when there was actually only one year of R32s.
lemming
03-01-2006, 10:41 PM
I was actually taking a gentle shot at misterlance's post as he said "any year" when there was actually only one year of R32s.
i'm in the midst of this daily because C5 z06 owners are convinced that because the c6 z06 is priced so much higher that it will keep their values up in the marketplace. i might buy that argument except for the fact that it hasn't really held water at all.
the _ONLY_ example of where a car has kept its value extremely well that i've followed closely and experienced personally is the 993 paradigm. bu tthe 993 has something the 996 and 997 do not have: a racing block motor and it's the last of the aircooled motors, too.
there is nothing special about the Mark IV golfs (1) and there is nothing on the Mark IV R32 that will not be surpassed on the R36 Mark V (2). ergo my suspicion that R32 values will fall like the Nikkei in the 80s shortly.
the R32's value is only paper money. i'm happy that R32 owners are thrilled now. much like E46M3 values now which still appear to be decent, the car is in store for a nice corrective valuation when the R36 comes out (similarly the e90m3 will nicely depreciate the e46m3).
This might be true, but here in Nor Cal the value of my 7 year old E36 is still close to 40% of its orginal cost. I can deal with that. =)
Sharp11
03-02-2006, 12:10 AM
The new GTI weighs almost 3400lbs, it's ridiculous, why can't VW build a light car?
The upcoming VW EOS is a pig, too - it has a retractable hardtop, I know these are heavier than ragtops, but the Mercedes SLK has a RT as well and it weighs at least 200lbs less.
Couple all that weight with front drive bias and it's hard for me to get excited (not to mantion VW's piss-poor relaibilty).
The R32 will be heavier yet....
Ed
lemming
03-02-2006, 12:23 AM
The new GTI weighs almost 3400lbs, it's ridiculous, why can't VW build a light car?
The upcoming VW EOS is a pig, too - it has a retractable hardtop, I know these are heavier than ragtops, but the Mercedes SLK has a RT as well and it weighs at least 200lbs less.
Couple all that weight with front drive bias and it's hard for me to get excited (not to mantion VW's piss-poor relaibilty).
The R32 will be heavier yet....
Ed
:yes:
i can't figure it out, either. but don't forget that the new 330i is 3415 (manual) and 3450 (sport package) pounds, also, despite the magnesium/alumin-ium engine!
Sharp11
03-02-2006, 12:37 AM
:yes:
i can't figure it out, either. but don't forget that the new 330i is 3415 (manual) and 3450 (sport package) pounds, also, despite the magnesium/alumin-ium engine!
That's why I didn't bite.
I was looking at the specs on the new Z4 3.0si, it's the replacement for my car with the new engine from the E90 330i. It's gained a bit of weight, too, BMW's showing it as 3089 lbs. The new motor's supposed to be lighter.
My '05 Z4 3.0 weighs in (according to BMW's specs) some 80 to 90lbs less.
What gives?
Ed
Jeff_DML
03-10-2006, 01:20 PM
2F2F for you guys? I like it
http://www.topspeed.com/IMG/cache-1600x1067/Sportec_GTI_RS300_2006_1-1600x1067w.jpg
http://www.topspeed.com/IMG/jpg/Sportec_GTI_RS300_2006_4w.jpg
http://www.topspeed.com/fast_cars/sportec/sportec_gti_rs300-ar3172.html
is VW making a four-door GTI this time around?
Hm.
is VW making a four-door GTI this time around?
Hm.
Yes.
It'll be here this summer, IIRC.
Yes.
It'll be here this summer, IIRC.
Yep. May or June.
http://www.vwvortex.com/gallery/albums//Volkswagen/Golf%20-%20GTI%20-%20Rabbit/Golf%20V/GTI%20-%20EU/026.jpg
http://www.vwvortex.com/gallery/albums//Volkswagen/Golf%20-%20GTI%20-%20Rabbit/Golf%20V/GTI%20-%20EU/025.jpg
Huh.
nice.
(this is bad...)
lemming
03-10-2006, 04:15 PM
the 4 door looks nicer to me.
the rear still looks like an A-class or Aveo on the road, though (i see that the rear is no different from the coupe rear).
cool car, though.
IndyMike
03-10-2006, 04:39 PM
Huh.
nice.
(this is bad...):+1
Real bad! The A3 now has some serious competition for my future daily driver $. Those body colored rims on the Sportec version ROCK! Together with the rubber fills out the fenders quite nicely.
Glad I decided to wait a while before pulling the trigger.
:+1
Real bad! The A3 now has some serious competition for my future daily driver $. Those body colored rims on the Sportec version ROCK! Together with the rubber fills out the fenders quite nicely.
Glad I decided to wait a while before pulling the trigger.
The A3 doesn't do much for me, the the price doesn't help.
The main problem with the MkV GTI is definitely price as well; I'm sure it's nice, but there are lots of nice cars that can be bought for $25k. A sweet lease deal may be enough to sway me, though, and I'm far enough away from a new car that incentives could come into play.
The A3 doesn't do much for me, the the price doesn't help.
The main problem with the MkV GTI is definitely price as well; I'm sure it's nice, but there are lots of nice cars that can be bought for $25k. A sweet lease deal may be enough to sway me, though, and I'm far enough away from a new car that incentives could come into play.
The A3 2.0T isn't really any more expensive than the GTI (maybe $1-2K, but not a lot). But it has that very cool sunroof, a nicer interior, and arguably nicer styling. And, oddly, the A3 2.0T felt more direct and fun to drive than the GTI.
The A3 2.0T isn't really any more expensive than the GTI (maybe $1-2K, but not a lot). But it has that very cool sunroof, a nicer interior, and arguably nicer styling. And, oddly, the A3 2.0T felt more direct and fun to drive than the GTI.
I prefer the styling of the GTI, and I would pick it over the Audi at the same price. Interesting what you say about the driving experience, though.
I prefer the styling of the GTI, and I would pick it over the Audi at the same price. Interesting what you say about the driving experience, though.
JST has driven both as well. Granted we both drove the GTI in the rain, but I believe he thought the A3 felt more fun as well.
And, even though it shouldn't matter, that sunroof is very cool.
The A3 2.0T isn't really any more expensive than the GTI (maybe $1-2K, but not a lot). But it has that very cool sunroof, a nicer interior, and arguably nicer styling. And, oddly, the A3 2.0T felt more direct and fun to drive than the GTI.
Don't read too much into that brief test drive--it was raining like hell when we drove the GTI. Tires might have had something to do with it, too, though I think the real answer is that the GTI has "stiffer" steering. The A3 non-SP steering is too light; the GTI's, I think, may be too heavy, leaving the A3 SP steering assist level as "just right."
Jeff_DML
08-07-2006, 03:26 PM
drove a broken GTI with DSG, wifes brothers friends car. I consider myself a diehard manual fan but I was pretty impressive. Upshifts where impressive full throttle, just keep on the gas and it shifts so smooth. Downshifts where less impressive but still decent, kind of cool watching the car blip the throttle then release the clutch or is that switch the clutch:confused: seemed slower then expected. Fun switching gears in a video game Gran turismo way. Also being able to select and hold gears is very key, also seemed to downshift if the car was going to stall. The guy seemed a bit worried about his car so didnt drive it hard, felt definetely noticed it was FWD and power seemed good but there was stilll some turbolag at the lower rpms. He had the leather sport seats and they are very snug on me, impressive for a car for america.
edit: woulndt mind DSG for my wifes next car.
lemming
08-07-2006, 03:48 PM
i am unmoved by DSG in the GTI 2.0.
i love the GTI otherwise and if i went that route for my dogmobile, i'd go for the manual.
Jeff_DML
08-07-2006, 06:20 PM
5 doors seem to be out
http://static.flickr.com/71/206070512_bdbc09e53d_b.jpg
http://static.flickr.com/79/206069345_d172dd0649_b.jpg
http://static.flickr.com/59/206069051_3954d48ef6_b.jpg
http://static.flickr.com/86/206068842_481d5eedd7_b.jpg
lemming
08-07-2006, 06:22 PM
still wouldn't touch a Mark V because it's instant devaluation city. VW has even announced an abbreviated run for the V's because they're too costly to build and already running pilot production of Mark VI's.
still wouldn't touch a Mark V because it's instant devaluation city. VW has even announced an abbreviated run for the V's because they're too costly to build and already running pilot production of Mark VI's.
If the lease terms are right, who cares? Let VW eat the costs.
The bigger knock against the GTI is that it is more expensive and slower than the Mazdaspeed 3. I like the way it looks better, though.
Jeff_DML
08-07-2006, 06:34 PM
yeah I saw this lease deal, not a lease expert so dont know if any good
http://www.vw.com/gti/offers_incentives.html
lemming
08-07-2006, 06:45 PM
didn't like the power (lack of) in the Mazda 3. shifter was nice.
i like the way the GTI looks, too.
yeah I saw this lease deal, not a lease expert so dont know if any good
http://www.vw.com/gti/offers_incentives.html
It's OK, but not fantastic. Working from the figures provided, that's a .55 residual after three years, which isn't awful as far as mainstream cars go, but it's nothing to write home about (especially since we are talking about a 12K mile/year lease). The money factor works out to .0018, or 4.32 percent.
Back out the stupid 1250 down payment and it's $345 per month. Add some options (like Package 2 and 18" wheels) and its up to $402.
Of course, this is on 2K6 GTIs, so it doesn't apply to the 4 doors, which are all 2K7 (IIRC).
yeah I saw this lease deal, not a lease expert so dont know if any good
http://www.vw.com/gti/offers_incentives.html
$309/mo.... Not bad...
I could be wrong, but with those details, I get a 55% residual and 0.00180 MF. That's an excellent MF and the residual is *okay*. Granted you're putting $1250 into a cap cost reduction (which you generally don't want to do) to help get those terms. Without the cap cost reduction (everything else staying the same), the payment jumps to ~$346/mo.
It's OK, but not fantastic. Working from the figures provided, that's a .55 residual after three years, which isn't awful as far as mainstream cars go, but it's nothing to write home about (especially since we are talking about a 12K mile/year lease). The money factor works out to .0018, or 4.32 percent.
Back out the stupid 1250 down payment and it's $345 per month. Add some options (like Package 2 and 18" wheels) and its up to $402.
Of course, this is on 2K6 GTIs, so it doesn't apply to the 4 doors, which are all 2K7 (IIRC).
LOL.
vBulletin® v3.7.1, Copyright ©2000-2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.