Porsche Cayman---> 8.11 round the ring

[JST]

According to this month's Automobile, the Cayman S circulated the 'ring in 8' 11" driven by Rohrl. They claim it would be four seconds slower without PASM activated.

Apologize if this is not new information.

[Jason C]

On the latest episode of Top Gear, we found out that a Ford Transit van powered by a diesel can get around the 'Ring in 10'08"49.*

*Passing at least one p-car along the way. :)

[Sharp11]

According to this month's Automobile, the Cayman S circulated the 'ring in 8' 11" driven by Rohrl. They claim it would be four seconds slower without PASM activated.

Apologize if this is not new information.

This car strikes me as a marketing exercise in extending an older platform, specifically, the Boxter's.

But why buy the Cayman when the Boxter can be had with an aluminum hardtop? It's the best of both worlds, hardtop/softop, for 10 g's less (and a huge inventory of used Boxters to choose from).

Having said all that, I'm certain Porche will sell a zillion of them.

Ed

[FC]

According to this month's Automobile, the Cayman S circulated the 'ring in 8' 11" driven by Rohrl. They claim it would be four seconds slower without PASM activated.

Apologize if this is not new information.

This car strikes me as a marketing exercise in extending an older platform, specifically, the Boxter's.

But why buy the Cayman when the Boxter can be had with an aluminum hardtop? It's the best of both worlds, hardtop/softop, for 10 g's less (and a huge inventory of used Boxters to choose from).

Having said all that, I'm certain Porche will sell a zillion of them.

Ed

Well, the difference is more like $6K, not $10K. It also has two more airbags. And it does get you the bigger engine, better suspension, and more exclusive car (for what it's worth). We'll see how it pans out.

Still, I'd have a hard time deciding between a Cayman S and Boxster S given what I know today if putting up the extra 6K were something I needed to be convinced to do.

I still feel that as far as a fun car, a stripped vanilla Boxster can be had for under 40K and you get a mid-engined Porsche roadster with (by most accounts) sublime handling and excellent hardware. Yeah, it is not very fast, but fast enough to have lots of fun. Keep in mind the base Boxster only weighs 2850lbs.

[Jason C]

I still feel that as far as a fun car, a stripped vanilla Boxster can be had for under 40K and you get a mid-engined Porsche roadster with (by most accounts) sublime handling and excellent hardware. Yeah, it is not very fast, but fast enough to have lots of fun. Keep in mind the base Boxster only weighs 2850lbs.

Where are you getting new Boxsters for 3-series money? If you're talking new and not used, then :scratch:

I must say, reading about catastrophic engine failures at less than 40k miles on rennlist doesn't give me a whole lot of confidence. :speechle:

And I hope their new RMS really is a fix, what are they on, their 5th RMS design?

[FC]

I still feel that as far as a fun car, a stripped vanilla Boxster can be had for under 40K and you get a mid-engined Porsche roadster with (by most accounts) sublime handling and excellent hardware. Yeah, it is not very fast, but fast enough to have lots of fun. Keep in mind the base Boxster only weighs 2850lbs.

Where are you getting new Boxsters for 3-series money? If you're talking new and not used, then :scratch:

I must say, reading about catastrophic engine failures at less than 40k miles on rennlist doesn't give me a whole lot of confidence. :speechle:

And I hope their new RMS really is a fix, what are they on, their 5th RMS design?

A base Boxster is 43K and dealers make about 5K profit. If you buy one at the right time, you could get it for 40K. Not a piece of cake, but it could work. Who cares, though, use 43K. My example still works.

Yes, the engines are a concern. But Porsche is VERY good about fixing it under warratny and often outside of warranty. In the end, the 2.7L engine in a 43K Boxster is as prone to failure as the 3.8L in a 100K+ 997S. I'd be far more upset with my 100K car blowing it's engine as opposed to the 43K Boxster.

While catastrophic engine failures do occur, and it sucks that they do, they are a VERY small fraction of the engines, and a miniscule one when you consider those who don't track/Autox the cars. Even plain-old RMS issues are still not universal. Probably not even half of the people. And while not cheap to repair out of warranty, even at insane P-car dealerships, it runs around 1K.

My point? If you buy a 45K Boxster (I'll throw a few options in), put in 50K miles in 4 years and sell it, you'll do as well as with just about any other car in resale and if you were unlucky and your engine busts, it will be fixed for free.

Let me remind you that the Boxster is a multi-year CR recomended Best Buy, so it doesn't blow up nearly as often as chatrooms would indicate.

But we all know it's a POS poseur-mobile. :twisted:

[Jason C]

But we all know it's a POS poseur-mobile. :twisted:

Check and see, are your hands at the 12? ;)

Those type of reliability issues just make me really damn uncomfortable. It's not the same thing as perpetually failing window regulators. It's no different than the S54. Sure, they have that big 100k warranty on it, and statistically speaking it's not that much problems out of all cars ever produced using that engine. But knowing how BMW handled it ("It spins the bearings, just keeps on spinning the bearing. They bring them in to have it fixed, and it still spins them!") and seeing how Porsche had since '99 to fix it, it seems to me that they're both using the "patch it up so that it'll make it through the warranty period" methodology of solution. That does not inspire any confidence in me, and I'm not even in the market.

But that's just my take. If you're going to sell it before it goes out of warranty, then :dunno:

[FC]

But we all know it's a POS poseur-mobile. :twisted:

Check and see, are your hands at the 12? ;)

Those type of reliability issues just make me really damn uncomfortable. It's not the same thing as perpetually failing window regulators. It's no different than the S54. Sure, they have that big 100k warranty on it, and statistically speaking it's not that much problems out of all cars ever produced using that engine. But knowing how BMW handled it ("It spins the bearings, just keeps on spinning the bearing. They bring them in to have it fixed, and it still spins them!") and seeing how Porsche had since '99 to fix it, it seems to me that they're both using "patch it up so that it'll make it through the warranty period" methodology of solution. That does not inspire any confidence in me, and I'm not even in the market.

But that's just my take. If you're going to sell it before it goes out of warranty, then :dunno:

No question. The situation is deplorable. Porsche really does suck for not addressing the issue properly. Like I said a while back... name another sportscar in the 50K range that offers:

-light weight (under or around 3000lbs)
-mid-engined chassis (or at least a balanced chassis)
-world-class brakes, suspension, and other hardware
-a decent dealer network
-a 4/50K warranty
-a comfortable daily driver with some storage room
-a versatile engine with decent torque
-reliability (except for the engine, of course)
-styling that doesn't look like ass in or out
-high-quality materials

Right. That is why Porsche keeps selling them despite the horrible engine issues. I do wish BMW, for example, would build one.

[Plaz]

But we all know it's a POS poseur-mobile. :twisted:

Check and see, are your hands at the 12? ;)

Those type of reliability issues just make me really damn uncomfortable. It's not the same thing as perpetually failing window regulators. It's no different than the S54. Sure, they have that big 100k warranty on it, and statistically speaking it's not that much problems out of all cars ever produced using that engine. But knowing how BMW handled it ("It spins the bearings, just keeps on spinning the bearing. They bring them in to have it fixed, and it still spins them!") and seeing how Porsche had since '99 to fix it, it seems to me that they're both using "patch it up so that it'll make it through the warranty period" methodology of solution. That does not inspire any confidence in me, and I'm not even in the market.

But that's just my take. If you're going to sell it before it goes out of warranty, then :dunno:

No question. The situation is deplorable. Porsche really does suck for not addressing the issue properly. Like I said a while back... name another sportscar in the 50K range that offers:

-light weight (under or around 3000lbs)
-mid-engined chassis (or at least a balanced chassis)
-world-class brakes, suspension, and other hardware
-a decent dealer network
-a 4/50K warranty
-a comfortable daily driver with some storage room
-a versatile engine with decent torque
-reliability (except for the engine, of course)
-styling that doesn't look like ass in or out
-high-quality materials

Right. That is why Porsche keeps selling them despite the horrible engine issues. I do wish BMW, for example, would build one.

I wish Honda would update the NSX (with a REAL update) and sell it for $50-60K.

[FC]

I wish Honda would update the NSX (with a REAL update) and sell it for $50-60K.

Yup. I'd be all over that (if I can afford it). :thumbup:

[Rob]

I'd be far more upset with my 100K car blowing it's engine as opposed to the 43K Boxster.

:lol:

Maybe, but talk about a BAD benchmark! I don't want my cars to go around blowing their engines no matter what they cost!!

"Yeah, my Boxster blew it's engine, but that's ok, b/c it only cost me $50k out the door." :lol:

[ff]

I wish Honda would update the NSX (with a REAL update) and sell it for $50-60K.

Obviously, that'll never happen. But there is hope that someday they'll make a S2000-caliber coupe for the Honda brand. Either to compliment, or more likely replace the S2000. Not an unreasonable hope.

[Jason C]

I'd be far more upset with my 100K car blowing it's engine as opposed to the 43K Boxster.

:lol:

Maybe, but talk about a BAD benchmark! I don't want my cars to go around blowing their engines no matter what they cost!!

"Yeah, my Boxster blew it's engine, but that's ok, b/c it only cost me $50k out the door." :lol:

That was brought up on their forum too. :lol:

"WTF?! So what if it's a Boxster and not a GT2? They shouldn't do this, period! My beater Toyota goes for 250k, what gives them the excuse to do this poorly?"

[JST]

I'd be far more upset with my 100K car blowing it's engine as opposed to the 43K Boxster.

:lol:

Maybe, but talk about a BAD benchmark! I don't want my cars to go around blowing their engines no matter what they cost!!

"Yeah, my Boxster blew it's engine, but that's ok, b/c it only cost me $50k out the door." :lol:

That was brought up on their forum too. :lol:

"WTF?! So what if it's a Boxster and not a GT2? They shouldn't do this, period! My beater Toyota goes for 250k, what gives them the excuse to do this poorly?"

Only poseurs want reliable engines.

The true enthusiast gains much knowledge from rebuilding expensive, finely crafted German hardware.

[FC]

But we all know it's a POS poseur-mobile. :twisted:

Hey, at least some of my friends are listening. :flipoff:

A buddy of mine who was contemplating 997 just got a black/black 996GT3 instead of the 997 with a non deletable sunroof. I am looking forward to seeing his car at the track in September Butt on Willow event. :thumbup:

Say it with me, M64 uber alles! :twisted:

Hey, if in 4 years I can get a good, used 996GT3 for Cayman/Boxster money, I would very interested. Of course, those engines are not cheap to maintain out of warranty either.

I don't think any of us would say no to a dry-sumped Porsche. Unfortunately, the new ones are insanely expensive.

[lemming]

8.11 is so fast, it's amazing.

let's put this into some perspective from the BMW enthusiast standpoint.

the 993c2 --> ~ 8:26

the e46m3 --> 8:22
the e39m5 --> 8:22
the eurospec M coupe --> 8:22

the z8 --> 8:15.

that's also faster than a lambo diablo and an F355.

jaded is what you are if you look past the out of the box performance of this car. finally, a TRUE modern 911.