Has anyone here

[equ]

test driven a 2009+ wrx or a 2008+ sti? If you have, how does it compare to the previous generation wrx?

I guess I should go out and do my own drives - which I will end up doing, but I'm rather short of time these days.

[clyde]

If the 2008+ STi engines weren't such grenades, I probably would have bought one last year.

[equ]

Really? :eek: Are wrx engines prone to this as well? Will STFA.

How is the ride/handling/NVH/steering feel?

[lupinsea]

I was looking into some long-term reviews of the STi a number of months ago. For a while it seemed like it might be an interesting next car: AWD + 300 hp + manual + hatch practicality.

Can't remember too much about it now. I think the review was through edmunds.com so you might be able to look it up there. IIRC, I think the newer STi is less edgey than the last one. Some like this as a bit more mature / refined car to live with on a day-to-day basis. Other miss the rawer nature of the previous STi.

Don't remember anything about engine problems. But I think there might have been some finiky maintenance issues.

Um, not sure if I found the long-term blog but here are some links to Edmund's Inside Line stuff:

Long-Term Test Wrap-up - 2008 STi (http://www.insideline.com/subaru/impreza-wrx-sti/2008/long-term-test-2008-subaru-impreza-wrx-sti.html)

2008 STi Parting Shotsl (http://blogs.insideline.com/roadtests/2009/05/2008-subaru-impreza-wrx-sti-parting-shots.html)

General STi long-term blog posts. (http://blogs.insideline.com/roadtests/Vehicles/2008SubaruImprezaWRXSTI/)



Read through the last link. Lots of interesting long-term blog posts there. Sounds like the Brembo brakes are expensive to maintain the the guys were changing the front brake pads at around 20k miles ($300 for a set of front pads, ~$500 for the Brembo rotor (that they didn't need to change)). Also repeated whines about the steering feel and how it's just not as good of a driver's car as the Evo. Not sure if this means the STi sucks or if it's a good car but just not AS good as another.

Also reporting a lot of creaks and rattles by 17k miles.

Care and feeding of this machine sounds on the high side.


Interesting post at IL: By the WRX instead. (http://blogs.insideline.com/roadtests/2008/12/2008-subaru-impreza-wrx-sti-buy-the-wrx-instead.html)

[clyde]

Really? :eek: Are wrx engines prone to this as well? Will STFA.

How is the ride/handling/NVH/steering feel?

I don't think the regular WRXs have the same issues. Most of the people I know that had problems were autocrossing them, but in some cases, the problems (including engine replacements) started before their first autocross in them. The specific problems seemed to vary car to car as opposed to being systemic, but just about everyone had something big go wrong.

As far as the other stuff, I can't really comment much because I don't remember a whole lot and didn't drive them on the street much, but nothing stood out as a potential deal breaker for me.

A good bit nicer inside than the older ones, but still pretty Spartan. If your expectations have been set by German cars, the Scoobies will probably leave you wanting.

[Terri Kennedy]

A good bit nicer inside than the older ones, but still pretty Spartan. If your expectations have been set by German cars, the Scoobies will probably leave you wanting.
Story from when I was shopping for the wagon (2002) - when I went to the Subaru dealer, I asked why the interiors on these were such cheap plastic, when they offered things like the Coach Limited Edition (full leather) on other models. The saleswoman said "Because the kids that buy these cars only have $25K, and they want to spend it all on engine, not comfort". :rolleyes:

[clyde]

Story from when I was shopping for the wagon (2002) - when I went to the Subaru dealer, I asked why the interiors on these were such cheap plastic, when they offered things like the Coach Limited Edition (full leather) on other models. The saleswoman said "Because the kids that buy these cars only have $25K, and they want to spend it all on engine, not comfort". :rolleyes:

The saleswoman was right.

The 500 pound asshole salesman that accompanied me on my test drive of a WRX in fall 2001 threw a shit fit every time I went over 4k. If he had let me drive that car as I wanted to drive it (you know, make it move despite lugging his excess spare tires around) I'm 95% sure I would have bought that specific car that day. Instead, I turned around, drove back to the dealership, got him in earshot of his manager and loudly let him know that he not only blew a sale, but guaranteed that I would not buy a Subaru and I'd make it a point to recommend to everyone I knew to avoid that they avoid that dealership (Herb Gordon in Silver Spring). I'm sure that putting on the performance in front of the manager did nothing but give them a laugh, but it made me feel better.

[Terri Kennedy]

I'm sure that putting on the performance in front of the manager did nothing but give them a laugh, but it made me feel better.
Maybe this is a generic Subaru issue? My first inkling that they were less than clueful was when I called them from a block and a half away, said "We're by the X Diner - how much further are you?" and they said they didn't know where that diner was. Despite it being a block and a half away. On the same street. With a huge sign. Idjits. :irate:

[bren]

The...asshole salesman that accompanied me on my test drive....
At least they let you test drive one. I tried to drive an STi in 04 and they turned me down. I guess I showed them - walked next door and ordered an M3 instead. :speechle:

Regarding the 08+ cars, as best I can tell it seems there was a TSB issued and I don't see lots of threads about cars blowing up (like there were for the M3's.)

[clyde]

At least they let you test drive one. I tried to drive an STi in 04 and they turned me down. I guess I showed them - walked next door and ordered an M3 instead. :speechle:

Regarding the 08+ cars, as best I can tell it seems there was a TSB issued and I don't see lots of threads about cars blowing up (like there were for the M3's.)

I don't see a lot of 08+ cars either. :dunno:

[bren]

I don't see a lot of 08+ cars either. :dunno:
No, me either. Didn't consider that was why.

[John V]

"Because the kids that buy these cars only have $25K, and they want to spend it all on engine, not comfort". :rolleyes:

Based on the knowing 10-11 people who own these things (and most of 'em aren't autocrossers)... Yep.

[lupinsea]

Hell, even i my old age I'd rather put the money into the engine / chassis / performance instead of comfort.

[Nick M3]

Honestly, was the interior in the '02 WRX really that Spartan? It had great seats, a really nice Momo steering wheel, and a usable stereo. Sure the materials in my '02 M3 are nicer, but, OTOH, the stock stereo was worse. (...although the fake carbon fiber trim was a pretty huge upgrade over the standard artificial plastic substitute.)

I still kind of regret selling that thing. It was a great beater.

Mind you, the bugeye WRXes are the only non-STi ones that I like. Subaru really started screwing them up when they moved in the direction of "comfort." The '02 had better steering than any of my BMWs, IMHO. My sister's '06 has no steering feel and is really twitchy on center. ...and the '06 comes with downright frightening shock valving. Katherine totalled the first one because of it, and I managed to scare myself trying the second one. I don't know what the current ones are like, but I would budget for a set of Konis.

[John V]

I call BS on someone totalling a car due to shock valving.

Very few sporty cars are more poorly valved than the E46 M3 but I don't see people wrecking because of it.

[Nick M3]

I call BS on someone totalling a car due to shock valving.

Very few sporty cars are more poorly valved than the E46 M3 but I don't see people wrecking because of it.
Do an emergency lane change in a 2006 WRX with stock shocks.

I'm not going to claim that her lack of driving experience didn't contribute. However, I'm also going to tell you that the car is prone to some really serious snap oversteer in those circumstances. It was enough to scare me, and I was looking for it.

Edit: And the stock shock valving on the M3 is not nearly as bad as you make out. That said, imagine something with less damping than the E46 M3 and about ten times as much suspension travel. See how you can get some serious pendulum effect going there?

[equ]

My gf spun out her '96 impreza wagon once. I had played with that car on snow and noticed some snap oversteer, felt like a spring loaded feeling, but you had to try to get to that point. I had been recommending shocks for some time when her oversteer/curb damage happened. I should also add that it was on brand new tirerack mailed tires during a rainstorm. (I rescued her from her awd car with my cayman on PS2's, :))

Anyway, never driven an 06-07, seems the worst of all worlds, horrible looks, still the old platform. I once almost bought but missed an 04-05, the bugeye was cuter, but the peanut (?) seats were better for me.

Not much of a modifier myself, but I could see that stock subie suspensions are lacking. But they are fun and reasonably well-built cars.

[John V]

Do an emergency lane change in a 2006 WRX with stock shocks.

I'm not going to claim that her lack of driving experience didn't contribute. However, I'm also going to tell you that the car is prone to some really serious snap oversteer in those circumstances. It was enough to scare me, and I was looking for it.

Edit: And the stock shock valving on the M3 is not nearly as bad as you make out. That said, imagine something with less damping than the E46 M3 and about ten times as much suspension travel. See how you can get some serious pendulum effect going there?

The stock valving on the M3 is about as bad as it gets. Harsh over small bumps with poor body control over big ones. I think they dialed in a ton of high speed compression damping to make it feel "sporty" but used soft springs and little rebound damping.

I dunno man. You can get just about any car pretty loose in a lane-change. It comes down to being able to control the car, ultimately.

[Nick M3]

The stock valving on the M3 is about as bad as it gets. Harsh over small bumps with poor body control over big ones. I think they dialed in a ton of high speed compression damping to make it feel "sporty" but used soft springs and little rebound damping.

I dunno man. You can get just about any car pretty loose in a lane-change. It comes down to being able to control the car, ultimately.
The stock valving on the E46 M3 is set for long, high speed cruising. Lots of rebound with stiff springs is not great on the highway. High speed compression keeps it stable over moderately rough pavement at 100+ mph.

As for the snap oversteer, it's the classic SUV problem. Subarus have a shit ton of suspension travel. For the most part, that's a good thing. However, while most cars would have body roll curbed by running out of travel or running into the bump stops, the Subarus keep going. I don't disagree that it comes down to being able to control the car. I'm just saying that the car is MUCH MORE prone to it than other cars that I have driven and that a set of Konis solved the problem.

Oh yes, and you don't hear about M3 drivers wrecking due to the shock valving because they'll almost always have a power oversteer issue first.

[clyde]

Honestly, was the interior in the '02 WRX really that Spartan? It had great seats, a really nice Momo steering wheel, and a usable stereo. Sure the materials in my '02 M3 are nicer, but, OTOH, the stock stereo was worse. (...although the fake carbon fiber trim was a pretty huge upgrade over the standard artificial plastic substitute.)

Yeah, they are that Spartan...epsecially in comparison to the German cars of the past 10 or more years. The seats are great. The wheel is nice. (I don't really know about the stereos one way or the other.) The center stack doesn't exactly look like shit, but it's boring. Functional. It was all utilitarian. The vibe was very much 911SC as opposed to a place that's nice to sit in while stuck in traffic. It wasn't actually that...plain, but it felt very similar...what you need and not much more.