Where can I get good basic tools?

[Jason C]

Though I've started the process of contacting craigslist sellers, I though I'd come here for some comments.

One of the BMW STEP instructors I talk to on a semi-regular basis has brought to my attention the need for me to correct my (relative) inexperience, not only by getting a part-time job in the field but by also simply working more with machinery/tools/the like. So now after about a week of pondering his advice I'm getting off my ass and doing as he says. The first thing I need is a good basic set of tools (the unobtanium-priced Snap-On can come later).

This is what I'm looking at:

http://www.craigslist.org/pen/mcy/44541135.html
About 300 pieces, listed for $300

http://b.im.craigslist.org/Yn/5v/ios2eFsguGYiV1hR9mTWbX8VyjbG.jpg http://b.im.craigslist.org/fF/nh/1FMKF0xhOvqea0QUz4TR6g7Yyc16.jpg


http://www.craigslist.org/eby/for/44409131.html
Listed for $75

http://b.im.craigslist.org/5o/bO/0vvsVCGadAoma8kPGPGyFofVX5z2.jpg


Now, I'm leaning towards this direction but I know there are people around these parts who have done lots of work on their own cars, presumably with their own tools (blee, anyone?). I think the above is reasonable but if there's a better way I'd like to know. Should I just go to somewhere like Sears and buy a set instead? Try Ebay? I'm not too keen on the latter, I'd like to examine the items before purchase. I've seen what happens to socket meant for ratchets/breaker bars but used on an impact gun.

Btw, even if I do go with this (I may have to move quickly on the items above) I'd still like to hear some comments. I know that these won't be my last tools, not by a long shot.

[bren]

The nice thing about Sears is that they are convenient. This is especiall nice when you need to replace a tool (lifetime warranty) since you don't have to mess with any shipping or waiting....just ride up to Sears and exchange.

[SteveM]

Sears is definitely handy if you travel or are a homeowner. If you're a professional, it's a little hard to drop everything and run to Sears because a tool broke (and you need it to complete the job). That being said, I haven't broken many Sears tools and if you don't seriously abuse them they will last quite a while. Most of my home tools are Sears.

As far as tool boxes go, I would spend the extra money and get one with real ball bearing slides. The compound slides just feel cheap.

[blee]

From what I've read, Craftsman tools are not the preferred choice among professional mechanics. However, I am not a professional mechanic. My tools see hard but infrequent use. I expect them to last forever, but I don't expect to make my living off of them.

All of my hand tools, save for a couple of specialized parts, are Craftsman. I find them to be reasonably priced and of excellent quality. I have had exactly one tool break on me, and it was from extreme abuse (think 1/2" ratchet extension exposed to forces that would make an impact wrench blush). Furthermore, I have never rounded off a bolt that was in good shape, and I've very seldom made a bad bolt worse. I've had my share of using the wrong tool for the task at hand, but that's got nothing to do with tool quality -- just of the monkey behind the wrench.

My tool set consists of a reasonably full set of wrenches (metric and SAE), 1/4", 3/8", and 1/2" ratchet and sockets (6pt, 12pt, metric, and SAE; I have nearly all of the combinations for 3/8, and maybe half of that for 1/2" and 1/4"), a comprehensive set of ratchet extensions and u-joints for all sizes, two torque wrenches, a set of screwdrivers, and a bunch of odds and ends. That would include things like Torx sockets, reverse Torx sockets, magnetic pick-up tool, mirror, stethoscope, etc. etc. etc. They're all kept in a set of Craftsman tool drawers. I didn't buy the ball bearing units, although I loved them; I opted instead for the level below, and they're holding up perfectly.

To start, you will need at least a full set of 3/8" sockets and a full set of wrenches. As you need the other tools, you can pick them up. Sears will let you save lots of money by buying sets of tools, and I recommend this route if you plan to do much work on your own. You don't need to go all-out -- my first tool kit was the very basic 3/8" socket set, and then I "graduated" to a 200-ish piece set along with two sets of wrenches. I could easily do 85% of the work I've done with half of that pile of tools.

[blee]

Oh, on the toool drawer issue -- no doubt, the ball bearing slides are the best, and I love to play with them when I go to Sears. (You should see my wife roll her eyes as I pull the drawers back and forth, going "mmmmm...." :roll:) If you can afford them, you might want to think about it. OTOH, the ones that I bought store and protect my tools as well as the BB ones, and I've yet to really need the BB slide's smoothness and durability.

What I really would love is a set of their Professional drawers. They're fricking works of art. At those prices, though, I would probably look into Snap-On as well, along with the price of a rental truck and crane to move the thing around.

[Jason C]

Argh, so very dirty! And sore. Brake work today was a bitch, and the stupid bottle used during brake bleeding tipped over twice! My clothes and my hands have never been dirtier.

I want to make this clear (maybe I didn't do this well): This is just an interim solution for the need of basic tools. I am not going to be doing major overhauls of customer cars. I guarentee you that if I get into STEP, I will invest in a lot of goods from Snap-On and Matco, including gee-wiz roller-bearing drawers. :D

However, at this time, the large expenditure is not justifiable. So I am looking to some more bargin-priced solutions.

I did notice that his Craftsman set is missing a torque wrench, so where did you guys get one? Sears, Craftsman, whatnot? Mr. STEP Instructor also advised for me to look for tools used during 20-point inspections or things to that effect, does anyone here know more about that?

[blee]

My torque wrenches are both Craftsman units, the kind where you twist the handle to set a torque value. They've worked well for me.

I also had a 3/4" torque wrench, which I needed for exactly one fastener: The crank nut on my S14. Came in handy for that.

[Jason C]

Ok, sounds good. We have some of the old-type torque wrenches here which have a dial that moves as you torque it down, never liked them. I like the click types with the twist in the handle.

Could you not use an adaptor for your other torque wrench? Not sure why you needed a specific one unless you're talking about the longer ones. Maybe your other torque wrench is an inch-pound one. :dunno: We generally use the 1/2" drives for lug nuts.

[blee]

Ok, sounds good. We have some of the old-type torque wrenches here which have a dial that moves as you torque it down, never liked them. I like the click types with the twist in the handle.

Could you not use an adaptor for your other torque wrench? Not sure why you needed a specific one unless you're talking about the longer ones. Maybe your other torque wrench is an inch-pound one. :dunno: We generally use the 1/2" drives for lug nuts.I needed to torque the nut to 317 ft-lbs. My 1/2" torque wrench goes up to 250 or so, and my 3/8" goes down to 5 ft-lbs. I needed the smallest one for oil pan bolts and other similar things, the 1/2" for lugs, connecting rod bolts, etc. All of my attempts to use a 1/2" anything failed, once spectacularly. 3/4" was the best way to go.

[Jason C]

I worked on the DCX SOHC 2.0 in-line 4, and all I remember about torquing is that the cam bolt is a real bitch to do, because the head would be off the short block and on some flimsy stands. The crank bolt was much easier. I don't think we had anything that required more than 250 ft-lbs.

Did you actually take the S14 out of the car by yourself? You must have some serious equipment in your garage then. I envy you. :mad:

[clyde]

My torque wrenches are both Craftsman units, the kind where you twist the handle to set a torque value. They've worked well for me.

My 1/2" Craftsman torque wrench broke after three months and about 100 uses. Still need to get of my ass and take it back to see if they will replace it. The warranty isn't quite the same on torque wrenches as it is on basic hand tools, but the tool failed...not just out of calibration.

[clyde]

Did you actually take the S14 out of the car by yourself? You must have some serious equipment in your garage then. I envy you. :mad:

Some pics of it going back in.

http://clydeorama.com/photos/thumbnails.php?album=8

[blee]

Did you actually take the S14 out of the car by yourself? You must have some serious equipment in your garage then. I envy you. :mad:

Some pics of it going back in.

http://clydeorama.com/photos/thumbnails.php?album=8Hey, I'd forgotten about those photos. I have a bunch more that I took myself, but those are (as always) excellent.

My "serious equipment" amounted to a set of jackstands, an engine hoist, and an engine stand. I got the hoist and stand used from a guy who sold me the set for $100, which made them two of the cheapest items in the rebuild. I wish I still had them; they were sold to a friend before we moved to a place with no garage.

[Jason C]

:dunno: Thought you needed more tools than that. Then again, I have been spoiled by our well-equipped facilities.

Edit: And of course, our conspicuous safety rules. No way they'd let someone drive in the shop and just remove their engine. :twisted:

[TD]

Did you actually take the S14 out of the car by yourself? You must have some serious equipment in your garage then. I envy you. :mad:

Some pics of it going back in.

http://clydeorama.com/photos/thumbnails.php?album=8

Oh yeah, I was there for that, wasn't it.

Damn, my memory really is shot. I need more sleep.

[Rob]

My torque wrenches are both Craftsman units, the kind where you twist the handle to set a torque value. They've worked well for me.

My 1/2" Craftsman torque wrench broke after three months and about 100 uses. Still need to get of my ass and take it back to see if they will replace it. The warranty isn't quite the same on torque wrenches as it is on basic hand tools, but the tool failed...not just out of calibration.

Good luck on getting them to replace that. The warranty on torque wrenches sucks. On the other hand, the perception is that everything is gauranteed for life, so maybe they won't know their own policies. :)

[blee]

:dunno: Thought you needed more tools than that. Then again, I have been spoiled by our well-equipped facilities.

Edit: And of course, our conspicuous safety rules. No way they'd let someone drive in the shop and just remove their engine. :twisted:

Well, I'll tell you something: There were many, many, MANY points along the way where I wished I had a real lift. MANY. OMGWTFIH8UBBQ kind of many. That said, lack of resources breeds creativity, and with the help of some of the local carmudgeons, I had a beautifully running car without spending as much as I could have. I was able to spend the vast majority of the total bill on parts, and only a small amount on tools. And the moment that engine started for the first time....pure magic.

[clyde]

My torque wrenches are both Craftsman units, the kind where you twist the handle to set a torque value. They've worked well for me.

My 1/2" Craftsman torque wrench broke after three months and about 100 uses. Still need to get of my ass and take it back to see if they will replace it. The warranty isn't quite the same on torque wrenches as it is on basic hand tools, but the tool failed...not just out of calibration.

Good luck on getting them to replace that. The warranty on torque wrenches sucks. On the other hand, the perception is that everything is gauranteed for life, so maybe they won't know their own policies. :)

IIRC, the warranty on their torque wrenches varies with the model. The one that broke was under a 90 day warranty. It broke after five, not three months as I first said. That was nearly two months ago. I finally tried to exchange it today. I walked up and put the busted wrench on the counter and said, "I'd like to exchange this." The guy said go grab another one, so I did. He didn't ask me what was wrong with it, didn't ask when I bought it, didn't ask for a receipt...nothing. He rung it up and gave me an exchange receipt and sent me on my way with a smile. :thumbup: