Some Evo MR pics

[ayn]

I know a lot of ppl think it's fugly, but I like it! :thumbup:

http://forums.bimmerevolution.com/album_pic.php?pic_id=181
http://forums.bimmerevolution.com/album_pic.php?pic_id=182
http://forums.bimmerevolution.com/album_pic.php?pic_id=183
http://forums.bimmerevolution.com/album_pic.php?pic_id=184
http://forums.bimmerevolution.com/album_pic.php?pic_id=186
http://forums.bimmerevolution.com/album_pic.php?pic_id=187
http://forums.bimmerevolution.com/album_pic.php?pic_id=188
http://forums.bimmerevolution.com/album_pic.php?pic_id=189
http://forums.bimmerevolution.com/album_pic.php?pic_id=190

Vid of an MR at the "ring:
http://www.mitsubishi-motors.com/TokyoMotorShow/j/sub/media/evomr_300.asx

[ayn]

Evo MR article with even more pics: http://www.superstreetonline.com/featuredvehicles/130_0311_evo/

[killerdeck]

The interior looks a lot better than the exterior. What does the MR stand for? You need to get one ayn! Quit talkin and go get one... :D

[Lartymarf]

That car will give 911s, M3s, Z06s, Ferrari's, a run for some serious money at the track. No doubt. Get one already!

[lemming]

That car will give 911s, M3s, Z06s, Ferrari's, a run for some serious money at the track. No doubt. Get one already!

yeah.

what's the holdup?

[i would get the Evo RS, myself]

:thumbup:

[ayn]

MR := Mitsubishi Racing

The RS is nice too, and cheaper than the regular Evo. But I don't think it has A/C. I could live with a car without A/C, but if one day I get a job that does not have covered garage, I'll be screwed.

[Rob]

It's ugly and the interior is pedestrian.

Doesn't matter much with the performance it generates though.

[undefined]

if TD wasn't so image conscious there's no doubt he'd get one :D

[FC]

I'll have to admit that I'm at least as image conscious as TD, but I could live with a black/black Evo and removing the wing/change the tail lights.

I think it looks much better than an WRX.

[Theo]

I'll have to admit that I'm at least as image conscious as TD, but I could live with a black/black Evo and removing the wing/change the tail lights.

I think it looks much better than an WRX.

The tails look MUCH better now that the surround went from chrome to black. ;)

I also prefer it's looks to the Sti.

[Doug]

The M3 just keeps becoming more and more mundane in the performance market.

These new imports are really impressive.

[The HACK]

The M3 just keeps becoming more and more mundane in the performance market.

These new imports are really impressive.

But they'll still be behind the curve once the E90 M3s come out, and the M1/M2 start hitting the shore as well.

The M2 will probably have a 250+ hp motor on a 2,900 lbs chasis, the E90 M3 will probably be 400+ hp monster on 3,200lbs chasis. Both cars are about 2-3 years away. Don't forget the current M models are already 5+ years old. Same people buying these STis and EVOs will just dump their cars in 3 years for a new E90 M3. :D

[ayn]

I suspect the E90M3 will be very expensive, don't forget the Evo and STi are $30k cars. I don't think a lot of ppl who buys these cars will dump them for like a $70k E90 M3. I know I won't.

And if I'd be happy with one for 3 years, that's very good already. 3 years is a long time, and I doubt I would keep a car for more than 3 years.

--Andrew

[The HACK]

I suspect the E90M3 will be very expensive, don't forget the Evo and STi are $30k cars. I don't think a lot of ppl who buys these cars will dump them for like a $70k E90 M3. I know I won't.

And if I'd be happy with one for 3 years, that's very good already. 3 years is a long time, and I doubt I would keep a car for more than 3 years.

--Andrew

It's not likely the e90 M3 will approach that. I'd be very surprised if the base price is above $55K. Heck, the new M6 with the 500hp+ V10 is ONLY going to cost about $90K loaded, according to U.K. price projection vs. U.S. price. Heck, at that price I think it's very competitive against the 'Chops.

I might have to scrap my plans and get an M6 just to piss off Stuka. :twisted:

[TD]

Damn, Hack, do you wave your blue and white pom poms when you make these posts?

Talk about cheerleading...

The only reason you get a BMW over these cars today is for image/status. But for the prices the newer BMWs are going for, even the image-conscious performance buyer is going to buy something else first (like a Porsche).

The days of enthusiast BMWs for enthusaists of average means appears to be over.

[ayn]

You guys forgot what I consider to be the BIGGEST advantage of the M cars, SMGII, no other cars offer a system that is even close to as good, not even the Ferrari (I've never driven one, but according to comparisons I've read). If they start to offer some kindda sequential manual tranny in the high performance japanese cars, then BMW will be in very serious troubles.

New Porsche's are also for image/status, unless you are getting a GT2, GT3, or Turbo. :) They build the cars a little bit different, so the first time u drive one u'll be blown away, I did. But once you get over that "first time driving a P-car" feel, u look at the numbers, and price, and practicalities, heh... it's very hard to buy a new P-car.

--Andrew

[The HACK]

Damn, Hack, do you wave your blue and white pom poms when you make these posts?

Talk about cheerleading...

The only reason you get a BMW over these cars today is for image/status. But for the prices the newer BMWs are going for, even the image-conscious performance buyer is going to buy something else first (like a Porsche).

The days of enthusiast BMWs for enthusaists of average means appears to be over.

I bleed blau mit weiss.

Let's take a look at some of our "choices". You want a roadster? The only thing in the market decidedly faster and handles better is the Elise, and Boxster handles better MARGINALLY for significantly more. You want a small luxury sports sedan? The G35 cost a little less than the 330i but falls short in handling and interior, and the 0-60 times aren't all that impressive for a car with 275 hp. Midsized luxury sedan? What CAN you get that does 0-60 in 5.2 in a stick shift AND offer the size and conveniece of a 545i? Hi-po cruiser? You're telling me a 996 TT at 120K is more attractive at 3,600 lbs (yes that's how much they weigh) and 470 hp than an M6, at 3,700 lbs and 500+ hp with more usable space?

Frankly, the Japanese performance imports have their own "market". People don't cross shop an STi or EVO with an M6 or Porsche or 360 Modena, but on paper, their performance isn't that far off of each of the above for 1/3 the price. Where the area gets kinda grey is if you're comparing the M3 to the EVO, but still, the current generation of the M3 offers enough of an edge, were $$$ not to be a concern 9 out of 10 people will pick the M3.

I continue to defend BMW because it makes sense. Heck, if it were purely performance per dollar I think I'd be driving a corvette right now. :roll:

[Rob]

The "average" BMW buyer (even "average" M buyer) and the "average" wrx/evo buyer are not the same person. There is some cross over, but the cross over is very small imo. BMW is not going to be "in serious troubles" b/c of the new upstarts - they are going to continue to sell every single copy of every single specialty car they make at a ridiculous profit margin.

You can argue that the "enthusiast of average means" crowd loses out and that may be true, but that is not an issue that has anything to do with the WRX or Evo.

Oh yeah, TD, I can think of a dozen reasons to buy a BMW over either of the two that have nothing to do with brand or snob appeal. They do have something to do with comfort and luxory, perhaps proving your other point.

[ayn]

rwg was right, M3 wins hands down in comfort and luxury, and dont forget it is faster 0-60!

but if you're into that kindda thing, the R32 is sorta a mini-M3, it offers the same type of comfort/lux/perf combo for half the price. (it's not M3-fast, but it is not half the perf or luxury either, it's about 90% close!!)

and rwg was also right on that the Evo/STi and BMW buyers are not the same person on average, most BMW owners are snobs who goes "what? a Mitsubishi? r u kidding me?" when I tell them about the Evo, they simply would not listen. and interestingly u can find plenty of ppl like that even in the enthusiasts community.

--Andrew

[The HACK]

but if you're into that kindda thing, the R32 is sorta a mini-M3, it offers the same type of comfort/lux/perf combo for half the price. (it's not M3-fast, but it is not half the perf or luxury either, it's about 90% close!!)

I think once you get to a certain performance #, performance/luxury per $$$ drops significantly.

Take Stuka's yellow chop for example. It is worth 2x the cost of his E46 M3. Is it twice as fast? Not even. Is it twice as comfortable? Not remotely close. Is it worth 2X the E46 M3? You bet. Same thing with say, a 360 Modena. It's about 2X the cost of the chop. It is marginally faster than the Chop. The interior may be better material but twice as good? No. Is it worth 2X the cost of the Chop? I'm sure if Stuka doesn't date for the next 50 years and scrunge up enough $$$ to afford the 360 Modena, he'd buy that Modena in a heart beat.

[ayn]

Understood.

[The HACK]

Understood.

Hey, any chance to pick on Stuka's lack of a "personal" life. :twisted:

[ayn]

That was the path he chose... ;)

[lemming]

MBR: you can get an Evo from the factory sans rear wing, it's the RS package that i said i'd get instead.

Hack: i continue to have faith in the marque, but the currency fluctuations as well as their continued arrogance keeps pushing prices insanely high.

i dunno where you people get these numbers from, but on any given day, an Evo or STi will keep up with an M3 through the quarter and won't lose much until about 120mph. given the cost delta, which is basically another evo or STi, that's impressive.

i agree that once the emperor's new clothes wear off, 911s are pretty plebian cars on a pure performance basis these days. the GT versions and the turbo are still "pure", thank goodness.

the Evo is a force to be reckoned with -let me write it again, an Evo with 320hp did the nurburgring in 8:09.

[FT@SGP]

Same people buying these STis and EVOs will just dump their cars in 3 years for a new E90 M3. :D

I highly doubt it. The STi and Evo is in cult status, some may jump ship but majority will not. These cars represent a strongly growing generation that just does not want Bimmers, Audis, or Mercs. I think the primary reason is how easy it is to modify these vehicles at low cost compared to non-existent modification potential on the M platforms.


Frankly, the Japanese performance imports have their own "market". People don't cross shop an STi or EVO with an M6 or Porsche or 360 Modena, but on paper, their performance isn't that far off of each of the above for 1/3 the price. Where the area gets kinda grey is if you're comparing the M3 to the EVO, but still, the current generation of the M3 offers enough of an edge, were $$$ not to be a concern 9 out of 10 people will pick the M3.

You would be amazed how many M- and Porsche owners have either an STi or Evo just for track purposes. I doubt there is cross-shopping for daily drivers, but client base is overlapping for sure.


I continue to defend BMW because it makes sense.
This is another thing that I don't agree, I think BMW just does not make any sense at all to me. Over-priced, no character left, and too disconnected from the driver; but I don't have problems with styling, certainly better than STi or Evo, but not purposeful.

Sorry I picked on you today Hack, it is not on purpose; we're just on other sides of the spectrum I imagine :smile:

[The HACK]

Same people buying these STis and EVOs will just dump their cars in 3 years for a new E90 M3. :D

I highly doubt it. The STi and Evo is in cult status, some may jump ship but majority will not. These cars represent a strongly growing generation that just does not want Bimmers, Audis, or Mercs. I think the primary reason is how easy it is to modify these vehicles at low cost compared to non-existent modification potential on the M platforms.


Frankly, the Japanese performance imports have their own "market". People don't cross shop an STi or EVO with an M6 or Porsche or 360 Modena, but on paper, their performance isn't that far off of each of the above for 1/3 the price. Where the area gets kinda grey is if you're comparing the M3 to the EVO, but still, the current generation of the M3 offers enough of an edge, were $$$ not to be a concern 9 out of 10 people will pick the M3.

You would be amazed how many M- and Porsche owners have either an STi or Evo just for track purposes. I doubt there is cross-shopping for daily drivers, but client base is overlapping for sure.


I continue to defend BMW because it makes sense.
This is another thing that I don't agree, I think BMW just does not make any sense at all to me. Over-priced, no character left, and too disconnected from the driver; but I don't have problems with styling, certainly better than STi or Evo, but not purposeful.

Sorry I picked on you today Hack, it is not on purpose; we're just on other sides of the spectrum I imagine :smile:

That's what makes this forum work...We can all disagree in a civil fashion.

Frankly I've driven a few of the new generation BMWs and I think they're taking big steps in the right direction. The new gen engines are flat out AMAZING. The handling of the new Z4 and the new 5 series is leaps and bounds ahead of their counterparts AND the previous generation cars. The 5 in particular is a marvel in handling for a car this size AND still maintain that lofty luxury and comfort. Are they more disconnected? Maybe, but that's just a by-product of advancing technology and driving dynamics. Do I expect ANY car to ever handle and drive like the E30 M3? Heck, the STi and EVO are NOTHING like the E30 of old.

If you want to drive a car that's similiar to and older BMW in feel, but superior in dymanics, go drive a Z4 with sports pack. As far as I'm concerned, BMW is, has been, and will continue to build cars that excel enthusiast expectations. They're just building more "specialized" cars to each niche. The 7 continues to grow larger and more stately, the 5 more luxurious, the Zs more sporty, and the 3s will continue to be the luxury sport sedan of choice once the E90 comes out, and the 1/2 series will be a re-invention of the old 2002 spirit with a touch of today's technology.

Damn BMW should hire me to write their press releases. :twisted:

[stuka]

You're telling me a 996 TT at 120K is more attractive at 3,600 lbs (yes that's how much they weigh) and 470 hp than an M6, at 3,700 lbs and 500+ hp with more usable space?

Frankly, the Japanese performance imports have their own "market". People don't cross shop an STi or EVO with an M6 or Porsche or 360 Modena, but on paper, their performance isn't that far off of each of the above for 1/3 the price. Where the area gets kinda grey is if you're comparing the M3 to the EVO, but still, the current generation of the M3 offers enough of an edge, were $$$ not to be a concern 9 out of 10 people will pick the M3.

I continue to defend BMW because it makes sense. Heck, if it were purely performance per dollar I think I'd be driving a corvette right now. :roll:

996TT is 3400, not 3600 pounds. I have the brochuer from the 2000 LA Auto show. :twisted: It's amazing what can happen in 4 years. I remember drooling over that car thinking to myself, how in The Lord's green earth am I ever going to be able to get one of those. :shock:

Unless BMW does something completely different this time, the M6 will get killed by the Turbo because of its lack of brakes. Actually, that is the biggest difference between the M3 and the Turbo for me at Sears Point. While both cars weigh about the same, if I had been doing the same kind of late passing (due to late point by's), the M3 would have been left with no brakes. The Turbo brakes just kept going and going and going. Heck, I couldn't even smell it. :cool:

Why anyone would compare an M3 to the Evo is beyond me. Yeah it's a quick little car, but it still has NO TOP END. 148mph, what is that? The M3 does 167mph in 5th for crying out loud. samurai:

For me, there is no other new car that I would buy but the M3. Actually, if they had imported the CSL, it is very likely that my new ride would have been it instead of the Turbo. :cool:

[stuka]

MBR: you can get an Evo from the factory sans rear wing, it's the RS package that i said i'd get instead.

Hack: i continue to have faith in the marque, but the currency fluctuations as well as their continued arrogance keeps pushing prices insanely high.

i dunno where you people get these numbers from, but on any given day, an Evo or STi will keep up with an M3 through the quarter and won't lose much until about 120mph. given the cost delta, which is basically another evo or STi, that's impressive.

i agree that once the emperor's new clothes wear off, 911s are pretty plebian cars on a pure performance basis these days. the GT versions and the turbo are still "pure", thank goodness.

the Evo is a force to be reckoned with -let me write it again, an Evo with 320hp did the nurburgring in 8:09.

The Evo and Sti will be left for dead at the Death Valley Cannon Ball Run by the M3. :twisted: 148mph is just so ridiculously low for today's driving.

Why can't they fix the stupid gearing and make those little cars go at least 165. :mad:

[stuka]

Take Stuka's yellow chop for example. It is worth 2x the cost of his E46 M3. Is it twice as fast? Not even. Is it twice as comfortable? Not remotely close. Is it worth 2X the E46 M3? You bet. Same thing with say, a 360 Modena. It's about 2X the cost of the chop. It is marginally faster than the Chop. The interior may be better material but twice as good? No. Is it worth 2X the cost of the Chop? I'm sure if Stuka doesn't date for the next 50 years and scrunge up enough $$$ to afford the 360 Modena, he'd buy that Modena in a heart beat.

191mph top speed alone is worth the price to me. :twisted:

Actually, I dunno about the 360. Plenty of people track their Turbo's, the same cannot be said for the 360. Given that quite a few west coast CCA'ers who have Turbos can easily afford a 360 (me exluded), I wonder why they have not gotten those? I am not convinced of the 360 liveability. However, I am convinced of the Turbo's liveability. Barring clients in bad neighborhoods, I drive the Turbo everywhere. If I had gotten a 360, I dunno the same can be done.

And you especially should know that the girl situation can't be helped. I am this way with everything. I know exactly what I want, and I'll live without it until then.

[lemming]

Take Stuka's yellow chop for example. It is worth 2x the cost of his E46 M3. Is it twice as fast? Not even. Is it twice as comfortable? Not remotely close. Is it worth 2X the E46 M3? You bet. Same thing with say, a 360 Modena. It's about 2X the cost of the chop. It is marginally faster than the Chop. The interior may be better material but twice as good? No. Is it worth 2X the cost of the Chop? I'm sure if Stuka doesn't date for the next 50 years and scrunge up enough $$$ to afford the 360 Modena, he'd buy that Modena in a heart beat.

191mph top speed alone is worth the price to me. :twisted:

Actually, I dunno about the 360. Plenty of people track their Turbo's, the same cannot be said for the 360. Given that quite a few west coast CCA'ers who have Turbos can easily afford a 360 (me exluded), I wonder why they have not gotten those? I am not convinced of the 360 liveability. However, I am convinced of the Turbo's liveability. Barring clients in bad neighborhoods, I drive the Turbo everywhere. If I had gotten a 360, I dunno the same can be done.

And you especially should know that the girl situation can't be helped. I am this way with everything. I know exactly what I want, and I'll live without it until then.

i guess i don't have the same top end fixation you do.

with those 'little' cars, it is surely gearing more so than aerodynamic drag limited top end. it's still not a great difference at the track because i have not myself been to a track where the cars got faster than about 145-150mph on the straights, so i think these cars are still within the limits of the tracks, actually.

i agree that there is not complete overlap between the m3 demographic and the evo/sti/wrx demographic, but there is enough for a valid argument. i think you would be shocked if you took the 996tt to the track with a good driver in an evo. it might keep up better than you think, especially in MR guise.

[ayn]

I suspect a lot of you guys have not experienced the Evo, STi, or R32 as a driver or passenger, you can't just talk about the cars by looking at their numbers or reading magazines.

I was very skeptical about the hype, especially when the U.S. version of the Evo8 was detuned. Now I know what they are about, and it's very hard for me to buy a BMW instead of one of those.

[lemming]

ayn:

i agree.

the same argument that they make when i make fun of the new BMWs applies again here.

one must drive the Evo, the STi or even the WRX and R32 to get a better sense for new the dynamic standard at the $30,000 pricepoint. it's so stratospherically high now that it's ridiculous and while it doesn't complete make the high end sports car market irrelevant, it certainly reinforces the notion that those cars are expensive and "need" at some level to justify that extra cost now.

....or just plain get faster.

;-)

[JST]

Damn, Hack, do you wave your blue and white pom poms when you make these posts?

Talk about cheerleading...

The only reason you get a BMW over these cars today is for image/status. But for the prices the newer BMWs are going for, even the image-conscious performance buyer is going to buy something else first (like a Porsche).

The days of enthusiast BMWs for enthusaists of average means appears to be over.

I bleed blau mit weiss.

Let's take a look at some of our "choices". You want a roadster? The only thing in the market decidedly faster and handles better is the Elise, and Boxster handles better MARGINALLY for significantly more.


Is it because the Corvette has already lapped you that you are not considering it? Even the current C5 roadster is fearsome. The C6 will raise the performance bar over what the Z4 offers to simply stupid extremes.

And don't talk to me about plastic quality and switchgear--we're talking about performance.




You want a small luxury sports sedan? The G35 cost a little less than the 330i but falls short in handling and interior, and the 0-60 times aren't all that impressive for a car with 275 hp.


A little less? Jeebus, since when did nearly $10K become "a little?" And the G35 sedan technically only has 260 hp, but it's 0-60 times are pretty impressive. And, in any event, there are other choices out there--the A4 3.0 is a good start.



Midsized luxury sedan? What CAN you get that does 0-60 in 5.2 in a stick shift AND offer the size and conveniece of a 545i? Hi-po cruiser?


Maybe they don't sell GM cars in California?

CTS-V, baby. For the price of a 530 you get performance (all around performance, not just straight line speed) that puts the 545 on the trailer. And you get an LSD.



You're telling me a 996 TT at 120K is more attractive at 3,600 lbs (yes that's how much they weigh) and 470 hp than an M6, at 3,700 lbs and 500+ hp with more usable space?


I'm telling you that damn near anything is more attractive than the M6. But since they M6 is vaporware, it's not worth discussing at this point.



Frankly, the Japanese performance imports have their own "market". People don't cross shop an STi or EVO with an M6 or Porsche or 360 Modena, but on paper, their performance isn't that far off of each of the above for 1/3 the price. Where the area gets kinda grey is if you're comparing the M3 to the EVO, but still, the current generation of the M3 offers enough of an edge, were $$$ not to be a concern 9 out of 10 people will pick the M3.



I'm currently cross-shopping the Evo, STi and M3. $$$ is almost always a concern. I guarantee that a substantial number of Evo buyers are potential M3 customers who drove one, bought one, and put the money they saved into something else.



I continue to defend BMW because it makes sense. Heck, if it were purely performance per dollar I think I'd be driving a corvette right now. :roll:

[/quote]

Oh. Maybe they do sell GMs in California.

[ayn]

JST, I thought you have an E46M3 already? no?

[lemming]

HACK:

1. the 996tt is "only" 3550 pounds. and stuka isn't too fat, is he? LOL.

2. there's no problem with automotive snobbery, so long as you know what you're losing to gain "prestige" --in the case of the corvette versus a z4, you lose a focused, all out sports car's performance and two extra cylinders, 120 horsepower and 190 ft-lbs of torque at basically the same weight. LOL again.

the difference between us isn't so large, it's our prioritization of subjective things about cars. we both like BMWs, but i won't suffer a performance compromise to keep owning one for myself.

[The HACK]

HACK:

1. the 996tt is "only" 3550 pounds. and stuka isn't too fat, is he? LOL.

2. there's no problem with automotive snobbery, so long as you know what you're losing to gain "prestige" --in the case of the corvette versus a z4, you lose a focused, all out sports car's performance and two extra cylinders, 120 horsepower and 190 ft-lbs of torque at basically the same weight. LOL again.

the difference between us isn't so large, it's our prioritization of subjective things about cars. we both like BMWs, but i won't suffer a performance compromise to keep owning one for myself.

Well, you've never seen Stuka eat. What that guy eats for a single meal can feed Ethiopia for a year. :roll:

And a Corvette has sort of crossed my mind. Maybe someday when I have enough dough to keep up a dedicated track car, a Vette would be it. A Vette or an Elise.

[lemming]

i think we're going to lose JeSTer to a CTS-V when he can get supplier pricing on one.

anyone want to take a bet with me?

[JST]

JST, I thought you have an E46M3 already? no?

I do. The lease on it is up in about a year, and I'm thinking about replacements.

[lemming]

JST, I thought you have an E46M3 already? no?

I do. The lease on it is up in about a year, and I'm thinking about replacements.

you could just get a 20 month lease on an Evo or a CTS-V for fun.

until the e90m3 comes with its 4.0litre v8.

[JST]

JST, I thought you have an E46M3 already? no?

I do. The lease on it is up in about a year, and I'm thinking about replacements.

you could just get a 20 month lease on an Evo or a CTS-V for fun.

until the e90m3 comes with its 4.0litre v8.

My rule is no leases longer than 24 months.

My secondary rule is never get the same car twice, so the likelihood of me going with an E46 M3 is small.

I haven't completely lost hope for BMW--I'll definitely consider both the M3/M4 and the M2. But, aside from the E46 M3, none of the other BMWs currently built interest me in the slightest.

[stuka]

The Turbo has an empty weight of 3394.9lbs, according to my owners manual which I have in front of me. :slap:

A far cry from the 3600lbs, no? :dunno:

As I said, all weights being equal between the Turbo and the M3, BMW really needs to do something about putting on real brakes on the M3. samurai: That is the weakest point of all M cars of this generation. Heck, even the CSL comes with single pot calipers.

[FC]

The Turbo has an empty weight of 3394.9lbs, according to my owners manual which I have in front of me. :slap:

A far cry from the 3600lbs, no? :dunno:

As I said, all weights being equal between the Turbo and the M3, BMW really needs to do something about putting on real brakes on the M3. samurai: That is the weakest point of all M cars of this generation. Heck, even the CSL comes with single pot calipers.

I saw an SL600 at the dealer... 8-piston calipers up front, 4-piston calipers at the rear. Those things were masive, as were the enourmous cross-drilled disks.

[blee]

I didn't realize that the MR is only about $32,000 in Japan. That's insane.

If I were in the market for a high-performance sedan, I don't think I could honestly buy a BMW today. BMWs are fantastic machines, and they offer quite a bit...but as far as performance is concerned, they're not close to the value leader. Indeed, there are several cars that can meet or beat the new Bimmers in just about every category except prestige. I don't think this has always been the case.

[ayn]

I saw an SL600 at the dealer... 8-piston calipers up front, 4-piston calipers at the rear. Those things were masive, as were the enourmous cross-drilled disks.

yeah, cool stuff, since that car is so much $$ they can afford to put things like that on it just for looks. don't think very many of the SL600 drivers bring their cars to the track, but overengineering is always a good thing! and they look damn cool!

--Andrew

[FC]

I didn't realize that the MR is only about $32,000 in Japan. That's insane.

If I were in the market for a high-performance sedan, I don't think I could honestly buy a BMW today. BMWs are fantastic machines, and they offer quite a bit...but as far as performance is concerned, they're not close to the value leader. Indeed, there are several cars that can meet or beat the new Bimmers in just about every category except prestige. I don't think this has always been the case.

I agree. I appreciate and WANT the quality/smoothness/comfort of my 330i perf pack. But to pick one over an EVO just for performance reasons is cleary very dumb.

And remember this is all based on the fact that I paid $36.5K for my BMW.

[ayn]

Well, if you like the quality/smoothness/comfort of your 330i Perf Pkg, you should take a VERY SERIOUS look at the R32. and if you think your exhaust sounds cool, wait til you hear the R32, I am so serious, it sounds just like the Carrera GT!!!

[Masskrug]

All brand preferences put aside, even if the car could drive like a son-of-a-gun, but it was ugly, could you bear to 'own' it?

I couldn't.

[blee]

All brand preferences put aside, even if the car could drive like a son-of-a-gun, but it was ugly, could you bear to 'own' it?

I couldn't.I think styling is an important part of deciding on a car. If you don't like the way it looks, then you won't be happy with it IMO. Even if you call it "ugly," you should at least do so with a trace of affection.

[FC]

All brand preferences put aside, even if the car could drive like a son-of-a-gun, but it was ugly, could you bear to 'own' it?

I couldn't.I think styling is an important part of deciding on a car. If you don't like the way it looks, then you won't be happy with it IMO. Even if you call it "ugly," you should at least do so with a trace of affection.

I agree. And to Ayn's point...

If I had to make the purchasing decision again, I probably wouldn't do it. Not because it is not an amazing car, but at this point, I could use a few extra dollars in the savings by buying a cheaper car.

However, and this may sound like an excuse to some, the ED aspect of my car was an OVERWHELMING selling point for me. It really was my dream vacation. And I like the car enough that I don't want to go through selling it or trading it for something new. I feel like I am just starting to get used to it. Finally, a year ago there weren't as many options around for less as there are today.

Except for buying that wagon/SUV next year, nothing is likely to happen in the car department till about '08-'09 when we are debt-free (except for the mortgage).

[undefined]

Except for buying that wagon/SUV next year, nothing is likely to happen in the car department till about '08-'09 when we are debt-free (except for the mortgage).

I'll bet you $1000 that you're wrong :eek:

[Lartymarf]

The Speed article about the Evo8 MR is correct.... if this car came with a different badge.. say.. a spinning propeller, it will be the most talked about sports car.

[FC]

Except for buying that wagon/SUV next year, nothing is likely to happen in the car department till about '08-'09 when we are debt-free (except for the mortgage).

I'll bet you $1000 that you're wrong :eek:

I'll take it.

FYI... When I bought my Benz for $10K I was a Junior in college with no full-time job offer. A year later I got a great job. I could have easily sold my car and bought a very nice one. But I was very patient and kept my boring, 10-y.o. slushie car for three years. Now I have a great NEW car. Trust me, I can easily hold out 5 years.

[blee]

The Speed article about the Evo8 MR is correct.... if this car came with a different badge.. say.. a spinning propeller, it will be the most talked about sports car.

Except it wouldn't come from BMW with the interior and price that it has now. I understand what Mitani was trying to say in the article, but he's exercising a bit of reverse badge snobbery.

[lemming]

as much as i admire the Evo and the STi, i also probably could not keep them forever because of the styling also.

the shape of the cars do not speak to me. most of it looks like afterthought which is something the higher end sports car options (MOST of the time) lack: they usually look like they were designed from the outset to have side rockers, front airdams and rear integrated spoilers.

i might change my mind if i got more driveway space and a bigger garage. then it's be much easier to revisit the issue.

[ayn]

Mitani was talking about the stock Evo8, not the MR.

[Lartymarf]

Except it wouldn't come from BMW with the interior and price that it has now. I understand what Mitani was trying to say in the article, but he's exercising a bit of reverse badge snobbery.

I guess that's why he used BMW as an example. It wouldn't come from BMW, but if it did, it would be the most talked about. I kind of like the "reverse badge snobbery." It's true afterall.

[Lartymarf]

Mitani was talking about the stock Evo8, not the MR.

Werd. I stand corrected then.

Minor mistake doesn't change what I think about what the author said though, close enough to the people outside of the Evo Enthusiast circle anyway.