Buying a 2018 Mazda 3 5-door

[Plaz]

Going to buy one of these in the next few days, and it's been a long time since I walked into a store to buy a new car.

Without having done any pricing research yet, my gut instinct is to offer to pay the MSRP number, all-in, including sales tax and fees. "Get me out the door for no more than this MSRP number."

Is that a reasonable approach? If not (or even if so), is there a new best site or other reference any of you recommend to come up with a better approach? Edmunds TMV was a good tool back in the day, but seems to be less so now.

FWIW the new redesigned 2019 models have been unveiled but are not on lots yet.

Honestly I don't feel the need to wring every last dollar out of the deal, I just want a fair deal where I'm not getting screwed, since I'm going to feel like I'm getting screwed no matter what the number ends up being, due to the inherent miasma of stench and slime that will remain on me from dealing with these amoral bottom feeders to begin with.

Any advice appreciated.

[dan]

That sounds way high to me. When we bought our CX-9 ages ago we paid many thousands below invoice.

Find a site that will tell you all the local and manufacturer incentives if you can

[dan]

https://forums.edmunds.com/discussion/17105/mazda/x/2014-mazda3-prices-paid-and-buying-experience

That's an old one but that's exactly the thing I used to guide my CX-9 purchase

[JST]

Going to buy one of these in the next few days, and it's been a long time since I walked into a store to buy a new car.

Without having done any pricing research yet, my gut instinct is to offer to pay the MSRP number, all-in, including sales tax and fees. "Get me out the door for no more than this MSRP number."

Is that a reasonable approach? If not (or even if so), is there a new best site or other reference any of you recommend to come up with a better approach? Edmunds TMV was a good tool back in the day, but seems to be less so now.

FWIW the new redesigned 2019 models have been unveiled but are not on lots yet.

Honestly I don't feel the need to wring every last dollar out of the deal, I just want a fair deal where I'm not getting screwed, since I'm going to feel like I'm getting screwed no matter what the number ends up being, due to the inherent miasma of stench and slime that will remain on me from dealing with these amoral bottom feeders to begin with.

Any advice appreciated.

I suspect for a car like the Mazda 3 you'll be leaving a lot on the table if you do it that way.

TrueCar.com is a site I've heard others talk about but haven't ever used, and it suggests that the average discount for a Mazda 3 is $3679 off MSRP--it claims it can get a bigger discount than that if I register, which I don't feel like doing.

I hear you on not caring about wringing every dollar out of the deal, but I'd at least ping a few dealers and see if they will give you a quote. Email is hit or miss these days, but the good news is that you can blast a lot of emails out pretty quickly and get a sense for who it makes sense to keep talking to.

[equ]

Note that in NJ, sales tax is 6.625%, $400 doc fees are common, add title/license, I'd say he is asking for a 8 to 9% discount.

That said, Plaz, the discount off MSRP on that car may coincide with that number or may be more or less.

[Plaz]

Right, no personal property tax, high sales tax up front.

That being said I didn't know on a common car like that the gap between invoice and msrp was that large.

I guess I should actually prepare instead of going by my gut. :lol:

Thanks.

[wdc330i]

What are you replacing?

[Plaz]

What are you replacing?

I guess you could say it's replacing wifey's '02 E46 325iT, though that has been a mere driveway ornament for a long time at this point. She doesn't really miss driving. :lol:

But it's really for my daughter primarily, though my wife and daughter will be sharing it for awhile. Before daughter takes it away in a year and a half (if whatever school she ends up going to allows freshmen to have cars on campus) we'll get wifey something new.

From what I'm reading it looks like I should be aiming at around $3.5k under MSRP, before taxes and fees. So you're right, "MSRP out the door" is leaving a little too much on the table.

[Josh (PA)]

Also factor in buying on ew years eve and a sales guy trying to get one last sale. You should do way better than msrp. USAA site says average of $2k off msrp

[wdc330i]

I guess you could say it's replacing wifey's '02 E46 325iT, though that has been a mere driveway ornament for a long time at this point. She doesn't really miss driving. :lol:

But it's really for my daughter primarily, though my wife and daughter will be sharing it for awhile. Before daughter takes it away in a year and a half (if whatever school she ends up going to allows freshmen to have cars on campus) we'll get wifey something new.

From what I'm reading it looks like I should be aiming at around $3.5k under MSRP, before taxes and fees. So you're right, "MSRP out the door" is leaving a little too much on the table.

Solid choice for a college car. I had a Mazda GLC in college. A three-door hatchback. It was a super stripper with one side mirror, no air conditioning, no carpeting (just vinyl covering the floor), and no radio! And a stick, of course.

My later Honda Accord EX hatchback felt like a Mercedes by comparison.

Mazdas have come along way since the early ‘80s.

[clyde]

Truecar is worthwhile as a source, but they're far from a final word. They exist to generate sales leads and that's how they make their money. Many of the places with price info get theirs from Truecar these days (not sure if USAA is one of them).

I suspect there's at least one good Mazda or Mazda 3 forum with reasonable recent pricing info out there and you can get all the info you need from it in 15 minutes or less. Another 15-30 minutes browsing inventory on cargurus.com (seriously, check cargurus.com out), mazdausa.com and local dealer sites should give you an idea of what incentives are available (and which ones you may qualify for).

After that, you ought to have a pretty good idea what a fair price is. Not a grind it out price, but a fair price.

I would suggest going the online route and do the bulk of your negotiating by email starting with the online quote request form on specific cars at a variety of dealers. The initial quote request is BS, but when they contact you in repsonse, you tell them what you want, you want to buy soon (that day if the hour makes it possible), and be demandingly firm that they break their quote out for car price, incentives, rebates, doc fees and state fees (taxes, title, reg, etc).

In the offer- counter-offer process, stay below your target price initially and let them come to you. If your target is reasonable and in the "fair price" range, it shouldn't take more than a handful of emails. Then, pick up the phone.

OTOH, when you know the price you're looking for, you can just walk in somewhere, but you're betting your time that it will work out at that dealer at that time. And it can. But if it doesn't, you've wasted a lot of time.

It sounds so much more complicated than it is and it's not a grind. You just need to know what you want to pay. Don't play the "out the door" game. Negotiate the price of the car separate of incentives, rebates, fees, taxes, and everything else. All that stuff will be what they're going to be. The price of the car is the about the only thing that can vary. Know what the other things are and use them in your mental calculations, but keep them out of the negotiation process.

The one exception is if there is any manufacturer to dealer incentives that the dealer chooses whether to use to close your sale. GM (or just Chevy?) had up to $4k "flex cash" available at the time I bought. The manufacturer was making $XXX available to each dealer for the month. Up to $4k could be used on any one vehicle, but once the full $XXX was used, they had no more for any vehicles for the rest of the month. Some dealers applied a little to each car, some put a lot on their hard to sell cars and would not put anything on their fast movers. When I was negotiating, some offered to use up to $3k, most $2k or less. The one I bought from used all $4k.

Remember that dealers and manufacturers built the system to get you to part with as much money possible. It doesn't take a lot of effort to find a fair and reasonable price. Decent dealers will get you to that price pretty quickly...you just need to know what it is first.

Good luck!

[lip277]

What about the Costco auto program?

[ZBB]

Keep in mind this is the last year of her current gen... you should be able to get well below MSRP just for that alone... The next gen was already shown at LA....

[Alan]

Right, no personal property tax, high sales tax up front.

That being said I didn't know on a common car like that the gap between invoice and msrp was that large.

I guess I should actually prepare instead of going by my gut. :lol:

Thanks.

I am surprised as well, you can get over $3,600 off on this car !? ... are they offering incentives ??

I’m like Plaz with these things, just give me a bit off msrp and let me drive away with a new car.

That Mazda 3 is a really cool car, I think you and your family are going to be very happy with it !!

[John V]

this thread is relevant to my interests.

[Plaz]

Truecar is worthwhile as a source, but they're far from a final word. They exist to generate sales leads and that's how they make their money. Many of the places with price info get theirs from Truecar these days (not sure if USAA is one of them).

I suspect there's at least one good Mazda or Mazda 3 forum with reasonable recent pricing info out there and you can get all the info you need from it in 15 minutes or less. Another 15-30 minutes browsing inventory on cargurus.com (seriously, check cargurus.com out), mazdausa.com and local dealer sites should give you an idea of what incentives are available (and which ones you may qualify for).

After that, you ought to have a pretty good idea what a fair price is. Not a grind it out price, but a fair price.

I would suggest going the online route and do the bulk of your negotiating by email starting with the online quote request form on specific cars at a variety of dealers. The initial quote request is BS, but when they contact you in repsonse, you tell them what you want, you want to buy soon (that day if the hour makes it possible), and be demandingly firm that they break their quote out for car price, incentives, rebates, doc fees and state fees (taxes, title, reg, etc).

In the offer- counter-offer process, stay below your target price initially and let them come to you. If your target is reasonable and in the "fair price" range, it shouldn't take more than a handful of emails. Then, pick up the phone.

OTOH, when you know the price you're looking for, you can just walk in somewhere, but you're betting your time that it will work out at that dealer at that time. And it can. But if it doesn't, you've wasted a lot of time.

It sounds so much more complicated than it is and it's not a grind. You just need to know what you want to pay. Don't play the "out the door" game. Negotiate the price of the car separate of incentives, rebates, fees, taxes, and everything else. All that stuff will be what they're going to be. The price of the car is the about the only thing that can vary. Know what the other things are and use them in your mental calculations, but keep them out of the negotiation process.

The one exception is if there is any manufacturer to dealer incentives that the dealer chooses whether to use to close your sale. GM (or just Chevy?) had up to $4k "flex cash" available at the time I bought. The manufacturer was making $XXX available to each dealer for the month. Up to $4k could be used on any one vehicle, but once the full $XXX was used, they had no more for any vehicles for the rest of the month. Some dealers applied a little to each car, some put a lot on their hard to sell cars and would not put anything on their fast movers. When I was negotiating, some offered to use up to $3k, most $2k or less. The one I bought from used all $4k.

Remember that dealers and manufacturers built the system to get you to part with as much money possible. It doesn't take a lot of effort to find a fair and reasonable price. Decent dealers will get you to that price pretty quickly...you just need to know what it is first.

Good luck!

Excellent, thank you!

[Plaz]

Solid choice for a college car. I had a Mazda GLC in college. A three-door hatchback. It was a super stripper with one side mirror, no air conditioning, no carpeting (just vinyl covering the floor), and no radio! And a stick, of course.

My later Honda Accord EX hatchback felt like a Mercedes by comparison.

Mazdas have come along way since the early ‘80s.

I think the thing that makes it an especially good choice for a 1st car is that it's severely underpowered. :lol:

My first car was a rusted out bug I bought for $50. It lasted about 6 months.

[wdc330i]

I think the thing that makes it an especially good choice for a 1st car is that it's severely underpowered. :lol:


Absolutely!

[Nick M3]

I am surprised as well, you can get over $3,600 off on this car !? ... are they offering incentives ??

I’m like Plaz with these things, just give me a bit off msrp and let me drive away with a new car.

That Mazda 3 is a really cool car, I think you and your family are going to be very happy with it !!
You guys should hire clyde to negotiate your car purchases for you!

[equ]

Are you going to close the deal on the 31st, the best day of the year to buy a car?

[Alan]

You guys should hire clyde to negotiate your car purchases for you!

Lol ... I’m sure he would do better than me for sure ... how he only paid $19k for his Camaro still blows my mind.

[3LOU5]

Truecar is worthwhile as a source, but they're far from a final word. They exist to generate sales leads and that's how they make their money. Many of the places with price info get theirs from Truecar these days (not sure if USAA is one of them).

I suspect there's at least one good Mazda or Mazda 3 forum with reasonable recent pricing info out there and you can get all the info you need from it in 15 minutes or less. Another 15-30 minutes browsing inventory on cargurus.com (seriously, check cargurus.com out), mazdausa.com and local dealer sites should give you an idea of what incentives are available (and which ones you may qualify for).

After that, you ought to have a pretty good idea what a fair price is. Not a grind it out price, but a fair price.

I would suggest going the online route and do the bulk of your negotiating by email starting with the online quote request form on specific cars at a variety of dealers. The initial quote request is BS, but when they contact you in repsonse, you tell them what you want, you want to buy soon (that day if the hour makes it possible), and be demandingly firm that they break their quote out for car price, incentives, rebates, doc fees and state fees (taxes, title, reg, etc).

In the offer- counter-offer process, stay below your target price initially and let them come to you. If your target is reasonable and in the "fair price" range, it shouldn't take more than a handful of emails. Then, pick up the phone.

OTOH, when you know the price you're looking for, you can just walk in somewhere, but you're betting your time that it will work out at that dealer at that time. And it can. But if it doesn't, you've wasted a lot of time.

It sounds so much more complicated than it is and it's not a grind. You just need to know what you want to pay. Don't play the "out the door" game. Negotiate the price of the car separate of incentives, rebates, fees, taxes, and everything else. All that stuff will be what they're going to be. The price of the car is the about the only thing that can vary. Know what the other things are and use them in your mental calculations, but keep them out of the negotiation process.

The one exception is if there is any manufacturer to dealer incentives that the dealer chooses whether to use to close your sale. GM (or just Chevy?) had up to $4k "flex cash" available at the time I bought. The manufacturer was making $XXX available to each dealer for the month. Up to $4k could be used on any one vehicle, but once the full $XXX was used, they had no more for any vehicles for the rest of the month. Some dealers applied a little to each car, some put a lot on their hard to sell cars and would not put anything on their fast movers. When I was negotiating, some offered to use up to $3k, most $2k or less. The one I bought from used all $4k.

Remember that dealers and manufacturers built the system to get you to part with as much money possible. It doesn't take a lot of effort to find a fair and reasonable price. Decent dealers will get you to that price pretty quickly...you just need to know what it is first.

Good luck!

I really need to hire clyde to get my Miata sometime ....

:lol: :lol:

[ff]

It's not hard. You just need to know your numbers and target car before you set foot in the showroom, and then be prepared to walk away if you don't get close to where you want to be. It also helps to remember that the salesperson is only pretending to be your best friend ever, and will forget your name the moment you take delivery and leave the dealership. Stand tall and confident, and remember that it's your money. Keep as much of it as you can.

[Alan]

Sorry ff but that just isn’t the method I like to use to buy a car. I look at it more for the long term relationship with the saleperson and the dealer.

I still talk to one of my BMW salesman who no longer works in the car business, I consider him a friend and he is a great guy ... when I go to Audi I get a hug from my sales woman and we talk about cars.

My Mercedes salesman just retired and moved out of state and we still talk as well. He is a really nice guy and i’m glad he is enjoying his retirement.

I also get very good service plus sometimes I get something out of the norm like the time the bmw dealer gave me an i8 for the weekend or more recently so the Audi dealer gave me the keys to an S4 so I could take it by myself for an extended test drive. I know this might happen in other states but here in NY they don’t give you the cars by themselves.

Anyway I know your method works for some but I just want to buy my new car, enjoy the experience and get a reasonable deal.

[dan]

yeah but you buy like 3 cars a year, every year :D


Anyway I know your method works for some but I just want to buy my new car, enjoy the experience and get a reasonable deal.

no wonder your sales people give you big hugs when they see you walk in :D:D:D

[clyde]

yeah but you buy like 3 cars a year, every year :D



no wonder your sales people give you big hugs when they see you walk in :D:D:D

Yeah.

[wdc330i]

I'm with AF. I do my research such that I won't be screwed, but then I make a decent offer such that they don't feel screwed either. I'm not in it to win at all costs.

[ff]

I wouldn't worry about the dealership feeling screwed. They won't extend the same courtesy towards you. And they won't progress any further downwards in negotiations if it doesn't make sense for them.

Just like the buyer should, the dealership enters negotiations knowing what their $$ numbers need to be.

Of course, your time is valuable too. I would never spend hours haggling over something like $200. To me that seems silly, and at that point it's probably more of a chest-beating exercise. If I can't get to where I want to be in the deal within ~20 minutes, then it wasn't meant to be.

[wdc330i]

I wouldn't worry about the dealership feeling screwed. They won't extend the same courtesy towards you. And they won't progress any further downwards in negotiations if it doesn't make sense for them.

Just like the buyer should, the dealership enters negotiations knowing what their $$ numbers need to be.

Of course, your time is valuable too. I would never spend hours haggling over something like $200. To me that seems silly, and at that point it's probably more of a chest-beating exercise. If I can't get to where I want to be in the deal within ~20 minutes, then it wasn't meant to be.

I think it's also a lot different buying a basic car versus a BMW. There are a lot more smarmy tricks at Honda dealers and such. At least that was my experience the three times I and my family bought Hondas.

I always find the least smarmy customer rep at BMW or whatever, and then take the deal to email only. I never cement anything in person. I need to be able to take my time, do my calculations, research, etc. without any external pressure.

[lemming]

Any supplier discounts from work? That usually helps a lot too.

[3LOU5]

AF is da man.

He strikes me as a guy who carries my monthly salary in his pants as pocket change, LOL.

[Alan]

yeah but you buy like 3 cars a year, every year :D



no wonder your sales people give you big hugs when they see you walk in :D:D:D

Dan you crack me up ... too funny !!


AF is da man.

He strikes me as a guy who carries my monthly salary in his pants as pocket change, LOL.

Lou, I wish ... if I did i’d be driving a Bugatti !!

[dan]

didja get one plaz?

[Jon]

I think the thing that makes it an especially good choice for a 1st car is that it's severely underpowered. :lol:

My first car was a rusted out bug I bought for $50. It lasted about 6 months.


Sorry to stray off topic, but I am hoping you get a laugh out of this Plaz..

http://forums.carmudgeons.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=12158&stc=1&d=1546823495

[rumatt]

:lol:

Welcome back Jon.

[Jon]

:lol:

Welcome back Jon.

:D

Thanks bud!

[Plaz]

Sorry to stray off topic, but I am hoping you get a laugh out of this Plaz..

http://forums.carmudgeons.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=12158&stc=1&d=1546823495

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

[Plaz]

Ended up with a base price $4K under MSRP, but after all the nonsense (e.g. "sorry, the windows are already etched") ended up getting out of there about $500 under MSRP, but with lifetime free oil changes.

Good enough.

Car's great, love the ass on the Mazda3 5-door. SO much sexier than the sedan. Not as underpowered as I remembered it, not sure if that's good or bad.

[clyde]

Ended up with a base price $4K under MSRP, but after all the nonsense (e.g. "sorry, the windows are already etched") ended up getting out of there about $500 under MSRP, but with lifetime free oil changes.

Good enough.

If, uh, you say so.

Car's great, love the ass on the Mazda3 5-door. SO much sexier than the sedan. Not as underpowered as I remembered it, not sure if that's good or bad.

Enjoy!

[Jeff_DML]

...

Car's great, love the ass on the Mazda3 5-door. SO much sexier than the sedan. Not as underpowered as I remembered it, not sure if that's good or bad.

congrats, 2.5l right or they still offer the 2.0l?

[Plaz]

congrats, 2.5l right or they still offer the 2.0l?

2.5, I think they still use the 2.0 on the "sport" trim level only.

[Plaz]

If, uh, you say so.

Also included all the DMV crap, their doc fees, taxes. I'm satisfied enough. Don't make me think about it too much now that it's done, clyde. :lol:

[Jeff_DML]

2.5, I think they still use the 2.0 on the "sport" trim level only.

stick or auto?

[clyde]

Also included all the DMV crap, their doc fees, taxes. I'm satisfied enough. Don't make me think about it too much now that it's done, clyde. :lol:

Enjoy the car!

[Plaz]

stick or auto?

Auto, for the wife and daughter.

Enjoy the car!

:lol: Thanks!

[Alan]

Congrats ... you have to post some pictures !! Mazda did a great job on that car !!

[John V]

Congrats. One of my buddies has a new Mazda 3 hatch 2.5L and I really like it. It is by no means slow. I'm willing to bet it's not much slower than my first car ('87 RX-7 Turbo).

The engine doesn't have a sporty nature, but it's pretty perfect for that car. I wish they'd put their new turbo 2.5 in the 3...

[BahnBaum]

Congrats Plaz!

Alex

[wdc330i]

Awesome!