new option solidified: JCWorks car or Stage I kit on MCS?

[lemming]

green light to move forward on the 3rd car again, which means the daily driver can stay low key and fuel efficient.

which would you do (or add options, i suppose):

1. current MCS with the Stage I kit?

2. get the JCWorks car?

there are nuances between the 2 options (and any that you might raise in addition), but the JCWorks car is appealing because it's a new turbo, higher boost, basically a handmade engine and the 4 pot brake package.

[JST]

green light to move forward on the 3rd car again, which means the daily driver can stay low key and fuel efficient.

which would you do (or add options, i suppose):

1. current MCS with the Stage I kit?

2. get the JCWorks car?

there are nuances between the 2 options (and any that you might raise in addition), but the JCWorks car is appealing because it's a new turbo, higher boost, basically a handmade engine and the 4 pot brake package.

Depends on the cost delta. How much would it cost to add the Stage 1 kit to the current car, along with a set of bigger brakes? How much would you lose if you traded/sold the current car and got the new one?

Of course, the most sensible option would be to do nothing--the MCS that you've got is already pretty well-sorted. But I understand that might not be preferred, even if it is sensible.

In any event, I would wait to do anything about getting the JCWorks car until I knew for certain a) that an LSD is available, b) that the ELSD is defeatable and/or doesn't intrude in the operation of the mechanical LSD.

[Plaz]

I went ahead with the Stage I because I didn't want to wait, and didn't want to be a guinea pig... I'd want to see how the factory JCW holds up for people over a year or so before buying in.

That being said, if you go for the factory JCW, I'll be jellos. :lol:

[lemming]

Depends on the cost delta. How much would it cost to add the Stage 1 kit to the current car, along with a set of bigger brakes? How much would you lose if you traded/sold the current car and got the new one?

Of course, the most sensible option would be to do nothing--the MCS that you've got is already pretty well-sorted. But I understand that might not be preferred, even if it is sensible.

In any event, I would wait to do anything about getting the JCWorks car until I knew for certain a) that an LSD is available, b) that the ELSD is defeatable and/or doesn't intrude in the operation of the mechanical LSD.

i'm driving a radically spec'd out MCS with the JCW stage I either tonight or this weekend. that will help to decide things.

there, the cost is only $2100 to have full factory backed speed.

if the JCWorks car starts at 28k, i'd imagine options would be 1500-2000 more for my tastes? it's not trivial, but sanity --> does this have a fixed cost?

[FC]

i'm driving a radically spec'd out MCS with the JCW stage I either tonight or this weekend. that will help to decide things.

there, the cost is only $2100 to have full factory backed speed.

if the JCWorks car starts at 28k, i'd imagine options would be 1500-2000 more for my tastes? it's not trivial, but sanity --> does this have a fixed cost?

A JCW-MCS spec'ed the way my wife and I would be happy would probably be ~$34K.

[lemming]

i know, FC.

i'd try to avoid spec'ing one out to that level of kit.

i'm mainly interested in adding the LSD and not much more, to be honest. the NAV is really nice in the R56, but not necessary. i could also do without the sunroof since it rattles. i don't find added utility in the leather option, either.

LOL.

[FC]

i know, FC.

i'd try to avoid spec'ing one out to that level of kit.

i'm mainly interested in adding the LSD and not much more, to be honest. the NAV is really nice in the R56, but not necessary. i could also do without the sunroof since it rattles. i don't find added utility in the leather option, either.

LOL.

If I went with the JCW I'd add MF steering wheel, LSD, rear fog, hood stripes, metallic paint, CWP, and Xenons. But I would add the sunroof.

My wife would want integrated univeral remote (which necessitates dimming mirror), armrest (at which point might as well add the convenience pkg).

And we'd both want driving lights and HD floor mats. I'm pretty sure that adds up to ~$34K.

[Plaz]

You know she wants the heated seats. She may deny it, but she wants them. Slip in the CWP. :lol:

[lemming]

If I went with the JCW I'd add MF steering wheel, LSD, rear fog, hood stripes, metallic paint, CWP, and Xenons. But I would add the sunroof.

My wife would want integrated univeral remote (which necessitates dimming mirror), armrest (at which point might as well add the convenience pkg).

And we'd both want driving lights and HD floor mats. I'm pretty sure that adds up to ~$34K.

i keep reading this blurb:

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/autoshows/geneva/2008/2008minijohncooperworks.html

i can't imagine a better way to get 30mpg every day and still have fun. small carbon footprint and all of that other environmental crap but still oodles of fun?

[JST]

If I went with the JCW I'd add MF steering wheel, LSD, rear fog, hood stripes, metallic paint, CWP, and Xenons. But I would add the sunroof.

My wife would want integrated univeral remote (which necessitates dimming mirror), armrest (at which point might as well add the convenience pkg).

And we'd both want driving lights and HD floor mats. I'm pretty sure that adds up to ~$34K.

You want Bluetooth, too, unless it's included in one of those packages, because a) the cellphone integration kicks ass, and b) it comes with a USB port for plugging in your iPod, and c) it includes the armrest free of charge.

[Rob]

The modern bluetooth integration is definately fantastic. Way better then I expected.

[lemming]

You want Bluetooth, too, unless it's included in one of those packages, because a) the cellphone integration kicks ass, and b) it comes with a USB port for plugging in your iPod, and c) it includes the armrest free of charge.

seriously?

are you guys serious?

that's a pricey little package, IMO. i never use my cellphone i guess so this is all lost on me.

[Rob]

It was included in a package in mine, but the integration is fabulous.

[FC]

You want Bluetooth, too, unless it's included in one of those packages, because a) the cellphone integration kicks ass, and b) it comes with a USB port for plugging in your iPod, and c) it includes the armrest free of charge.

It's part of the convenience package (which also includes comfort access).

[JST]

seriously?

are you guys serious?

that's a pricey little package, IMO. i never use my cellphone i guess so this is all lost on me.

I don't use mine that much, either, but when I do, it's awesome. I had it in my ZHP, have it in the 335, and would get it in every BMW I get from now on. The USB port in the Mini is an added bonus, which I would get if I could.

Comfort access, OTOH, I have no use for.

[Plaz]

USB iPod integration rocks.

The Bluetooth works flawlessly, including voice dialing. (though you have to remember to wait for the beep before speaking)

The traffic alerts on the nav are pretty cool too.

[SARAFIL]

I don't use mine that much, either, but when I do, it's awesome. I had it in my ZHP, have it in the 335, and would get it in every BMW I get from now on. The USB port in the Mini is an added bonus, which I would get if I could.

Comfort access, OTOH, I have no use for.

Putting the key in the slot to start the engine is not a big deal... but where I really find Comfort Access handy is when you are walking up to the car with your hands full, and you don't have to reach into your pocket to find the key, find the unlock button and press it. It's certainly an option I could live without, but it is pretty handy to have.

And since I pay nothing for the MINIs that I drive, I always make sure that they are loaded! ;) I just ordered my next car today, and went with all 4 packages plus some extra things like chrome-line interior, white turn signals, xenons, anthracite headliner, etc. Except this time I passed on Navi and Sirius and I'm getting the 17" web-spoke wheels with performance tires and the JCW tuning kit. ;)

[SARAFIL]

green light to move forward on the 3rd car again, which means the daily driver can stay low key and fuel efficient.

which would you do (or add options, i suppose):

1. current MCS with the Stage I kit?

2. get the JCWorks car?

there are nuances between the 2 options (and any that you might raise in addition), but the JCWorks car is appealing because it's a new turbo, higher boost, basically a handmade engine and the 4 pot brake package.

How you equip the JCWorks car would greatly impact your decision, I think. If you go basic, you can certainly be in the low $30's. Figure $28,500 base, plus $500 LSD, $500 CWP, $500 metallic paint, $500 xenons, and maybe a few extras.

If you equip it like I probably would, it would be mid-$30's. I'd want the above plus leather, sunroof, premium sound system, bluetooth/USB.

[lemming]

How you equip the JCWorks car would greatly impact your decision, I think. If you go basic, you can certainly be in the low $30's. Figure $28,500 base, plus $500 LSD, $500 CWP, $500 metallic paint, $500 xenons, and maybe a few extras.

If you equip it like I probably would, it would be mid-$30's. I'd want the above plus leather, sunroof, premium sound system, bluetooth/USB.

i hope you're not offended that i'd want a more basic car, 'Fil.

:D

it's just harder for me to justify a car that normally starts at 23k (the basic MCS) to leave the dealer at 35k. it'd have to be flat out awesome because that's right where the world's most basic 1er sits.

so, the closer i am to 30ish the more "logical' it is. even though this is more about suppressing insanity than it is sanity.

[SARAFIL]

i hope you're not offended that i'd want a more basic car, 'Fil.

:D

it's just harder for me to justify a car that normally starts at 23k (the basic MCS) to leave the dealer at 35k. it'd have to be flat out awesome because that's right where the world's most basic 1er sits.

so, the closer i am to 30ish the more "logical' it is. even though this is more about suppressing insanity than it is sanity.

I see where you are coming from... (and tend to agree with your stand on this one)

[Rob]

I can't imagine $35k for a mini. That's 1 series territory and maybe even 328 territory. The bluetooth really is that awesome though - and your state may soon have rules about using hands free devices. The integration of the bluetooth into the car is so very much better then a blue tooth earpiece, I can't even begin to describe the difference.

I bought the comfort access on the 3 and I like having it - there are a lot of cool features to appreciate. I wouldn't cry if it was gone though.

[lemming]

I can't imagine $35k for a mini. That's 1 series territory and maybe even 328 territory. The bluetooth really is that awesome though - and your state may soon have rules about using hands free devices. The integration of the bluetooth into the car is so very much better then a blue tooth earpiece, I can't even begin to describe the difference.

I bought the comfort access on the 3 and I like having it - there are a lot of cool features to appreciate. I wouldn't cry if it was gone though.

grrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

you guys are really good at spending other people's money.

[FC]

I dunno. $34K (what my MCS comes to) is a lot of dough, but if we buy one, it would not be becasue it's the sensible car. It would be because it is cute, tiny, has lots of personality, and is fun to drive.

I need to compare them, but if an extra few $K means now my wife will have a car she likes that I like too, it's worth it. And if we keep it "forever" I won't really care much if it was 30K or 34K. I rather get everything I want so I don't regret it for a decade.

Comparing the MCS to the 128i just because the price tag is getting up there is, IMO, saying you really want a 128i but didn't want to spend that much. But since your back up option is almost as much, you may as well get your first choice. Similarly, I don't care how pricey a 987S can get after adding lots of options, I would always buy it over a base 997 cabrio even for equal money.

To my wife the MCS has no competition. It's her dream car. It's that or nothing (similar). And I should feel lucky she doesn't have a crush on a RR, etc.

[lemming]

I dunno. $34K (what my MCS comes to) is a lot of dough, but if we buy one, it would not be becasue it's the sensible car. It would be because it is cute, tiny, has lots of personality, and is fun to drive.

I need to compare them, but if an extra few $K means now my wife will have a car she likes that I like too, it's worth it. And if we keep it "forever" I won't really care much if it was 30K or 34K. I rather get everything I want so I don't regret it for a decade.

Comparing the MCS to the 128i just because the price tag is getting up there is, IMO, saying you really want a 128i but didn't want to spend that much. But since your back up option is almost as much, you may as well get your first choice. Similarly, I don't care how pricey a 987S can get after adding lots of options, I would always buy it over a base 997 cabrio even for equal money.

To my wife the MCS has no competition. It's her dream car. It's that or nothing (similar). And I should feel lucky she doesn't have a crush on a RR, etc.

your logic is the only reason why i could entertain spending ~30k for a MINI --because i'd keep it. JeSTer is right, i could easily keep the car i have because it's so frugal, fun to drive and paid off in full. no worries. it's a really nice commuting option.

i guess, the JCWorks car just addresses some of the things i think i miss (slightly) in the standard MCS: just a smidge more power, just a slightly tighter suspension and an exhaust snarl. is that worth the added money? :dunno:

if you look in-depth at the JCWorks package, they basically go from the standard 1.6L Turbo engine in the Mini Cooper S and enter the realm of semi-handmade motors. it's got lower compression, more forged parts, a bigger turbo, a new exhaust path, etc. the entire package is based at 28k --is it 5k better than the standard MCS? when you consider full factory backing, i'd still say "yes".

this bluefang stuff, though, i dunno about that.

[JST]

your logic is the only reason why i could entertain spending ~30k for a MINI --because i'd keep it. JeSTer is right, i could easily keep the car i have because it's so frugal, fun to drive and paid off in full. no worries. it's a really nice commuting option.

i guess, the JCWorks car just addresses some of the things i think i miss (slightly) in the standard MCS: just a smidge more power, just a slightly tighter suspension and an exhaust snarl. is that worth the added money? :dunno:

if you look in-depth at the JCWorks package, they basically go from the standard 1.6L Turbo engine in the Mini Cooper S and enter the realm of semi-handmade motors. it's got lower compression, more forged parts, a bigger turbo, a new exhaust path, etc. the entire package is based at 28k --is it 5k better than the standard MCS? when you consider full factory backing, i'd still say "yes".

this bluefang stuff, though, i dunno about that.

Does the JCW car come with a different suspension? I haven't concentrated on it, but my impression from the press release was that it was engine + brakes.

[FC]

your logic is the only reason why i could entertain spending ~30k for a MINI --because i'd keep it. JeSTer is right, i could easily keep the car i have because it's so frugal, fun to drive and paid off in full. no worries. it's a really nice commuting option.

i guess, the JCWorks car just addresses some of the things i think i miss (slightly) in the standard MCS: just a smidge more power, just a slightly tighter suspension and an exhaust snarl. is that worth the added money? :dunno:

if you look in-depth at the JCWorks package, they basically go from the standard 1.6L Turbo engine in the Mini Cooper S and enter the realm of semi-handmade motors. it's got lower compression, more forged parts, a bigger turbo, a new exhaust path, etc. the entire package is based at 28k --is it 5k better than the standard MCS? when you consider full factory backing, i'd still say "yes".

this bluefang stuff, though, i dunno about that.

The JCW motor seems nice. The nice brakes and wheels are cool too. I assume the exhaust note is nicer.

I dunno about BT either, but who knows what other cool stuff may be BT compatible in years to come? Once you add universal remote ($250 whihc forces upon you dimmign mirror, another $250) MF steering wheel ($250) and an armrest you are up to about $1K. For an extra $500 the convenience pkg gives you BT/phone integration, comfort access and auto wipers. I figure it's worth getting.

[lemming]

taken from the edmunds.com release:

The new engine carries a number of detailed modifications, including specially ground pistons, a more rigid cylinder head and reworked valve seat rings along with 18.9 pounds of turbocharger boost. Still, there's little doubt that aftermarket tuners will easily be able to liberate a good deal more with even higher boost pressure and a higher-volume intake manifold.

In typical Mini practice, drive is sent to the front wheels via a closely stacked six-speed Getrag manual gearbox and 3.65:1 final-drive ratio. Additionally, the John Cooper Works gets an electronically controlled locking differential function that is engaged via the DSC (dynamic stability control) switch. Mini claims zero to 62 mph in 6.5 seconds for the three-door hatchback, an improvement of just 0.2 second. The larger Clubman requires a slightly longer 6.8 seconds. Top speed in each case is 148 mph — some 8 mph up on the first-generation John Cooper Works. Combined fuel consumption, always a Mini strong point, is put at 34 mpg for the coupe and 33 mpg for the Clubman.

Building on the already highly agile nature of the second-generation Cooper S, its MacPherson strut front and multilink rear suspension has been heavily retuned, with firmer bushings, springs and dampers, together with more resilient stabilizers and a lower ride height. Along with the standard suspension, Mini is offering two optional packages that are claimed to elevate the new model's dynamic behavior even further. They include a Sports package that adds firmer dampers at each corner as well as beefed-up stabilizer bars front and rear — all aimed at providing greater body control.

Above that is the so-called John Cooper Works package, aimed primarily at customers who intend on heading to the track. It further lowers the ride height and adds even firmer dampers and larger stabilizers. Other changes center around the weighting of the electronically assisted steering system and the mapping of the throttle — both of which can be altered via a Sports switch on the dashboard console. The settings chosen for the John Cooper Works differ from those found on the Cooper S (http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FullTests/articleId=120652), giving it what Mini describes as "an even more aggressive nature."

The brakes have also grown in size and ability. They now measure 12.3 inches in diameter and are vented up front, with the rear receiving solid 11-inch rotors. The calipers, too, have been upgraded and, as on the first-generation model, are painted red and bear the JCW emblem. There's no shortage of electric driving aids. Standard equipment includes ABS antilock for the brakes, EBD (electronic brakeforce distribution), CBC (cornering brake control) and DSC (Dynamic Stability Control), including hill-start assistance and DTC (Dynamic Traction Control).

Pricing in the U.S. will be $28,550 for the R56 coupe and $30,800 for the R56 Clubman, with sales beginning in August.

J: it looks like a lot of the suspension work is extra dough --not so clear if it's tuned differently from the standard MCS, but i'm just assuming it is so.

[FC]

I think the JCW will have the stock suspension.

[ff]

Combined fuel consumption, always a Mini strong point, is put at 34 mpg for the coupe and 33 mpg for the Clubman.

I seriously doubt that.

[JST]

taken from the edmunds.com release:

The new engine carries a number of detailed modifications, including specially ground pistons, a more rigid cylinder head and reworked valve seat rings along with 18.9 pounds of turbocharger boost. Still, there's little doubt that aftermarket tuners will easily be able to liberate a good deal more with even higher boost pressure and a higher-volume intake manifold.

In typical Mini practice, drive is sent to the front wheels via a closely stacked six-speed Getrag manual gearbox and 3.65:1 final-drive ratio. Additionally, the John Cooper Works gets an electronically controlled locking differential function that is engaged via the DSC (dynamic stability control) switch. Mini claims zero to 62 mph in 6.5 seconds for the three-door hatchback, an improvement of just 0.2 second. The larger Clubman requires a slightly longer 6.8 seconds. Top speed in each case is 148 mph — some 8 mph up on the first-generation John Cooper Works. Combined fuel consumption, always a Mini strong point, is put at 34 mpg for the coupe and 33 mpg for the Clubman.

Building on the already highly agile nature of the second-generation Cooper S, its MacPherson strut front and multilink rear suspension has been heavily retuned, with firmer bushings, springs and dampers, together with more resilient stabilizers and a lower ride height. Along with the standard suspension, Mini is offering two optional packages that are claimed to elevate the new model's dynamic behavior even further. They include a Sports package that adds firmer dampers at each corner as well as beefed-up stabilizer bars front and rear — all aimed at providing greater body control.

Above that is the so-called John Cooper Works package, aimed primarily at customers who intend on heading to the track. It further lowers the ride height and adds even firmer dampers and larger stabilizers. Other changes center around the weighting of the electronically assisted steering system and the mapping of the throttle — both of which can be altered via a Sports switch on the dashboard console. The settings chosen for the John Cooper Works differ from those found on the Cooper S (http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FullTests/articleId=120652), giving it what Mini describes as "an even more aggressive nature."

The brakes have also grown in size and ability. They now measure 12.3 inches in diameter and are vented up front, with the rear receiving solid 11-inch rotors. The calipers, too, have been upgraded and, as on the first-generation model, are painted red and bear the JCW emblem. There's no shortage of electric driving aids. Standard equipment includes ABS antilock for the brakes, EBD (electronic brakeforce distribution), CBC (cornering brake control) and DSC (Dynamic Stability Control), including hill-start assistance and DTC (Dynamic Traction Control).

Pricing in the U.S. will be $28,550 for the R56 coupe and $30,800 for the R56 Clubman, with sales beginning in August.

J: it looks like a lot of the suspension work is extra dough --not so clear if it's tuned differently from the standard MCS, but i'm just assuming it is so.

Ah, thanks. I was mis-remembering the press release, but I agree that it's a bit confusing--the JCWorks car is going to have an optional hard-core JCWorks suspension package? Why not give that a different name?

I'm not sure that even more aggressive throttle mapping is necessary or desirable, although I suppose if they made the MCS "sport" program the JCWorks "standard" program that would be nice--would keep you from having to hit the sport button every time you started the car.

[Plaz]

I seriously doubt that.

I'm averaging 30 combined so far, and I'm still on my second tank. I think it will probably get a little bit better as the engine loosens up some more.

But I don't think it will get to 34. And I just have Stage I.

[Rob]

Comparing the MCS to the 128i just because the price tag is getting up there is, IMO, saying you really want a 128i but didn't want to spend that much. But since your back up option is almost as much, you may as well get your first choice.

Not necessarily. Accepting a MINI at 25k is acknowledging that you are making compromises, but it's ok b/c the car is less expensive to buy, own and operate. When you take the less expensive portion of that equation away, then you have to think about whether the compromises still make sense. It's not that you prefer the 328 or whatever, it's a new question of whether the MINI package is worth the opportunity cost.

In your case, you aren't talking about compromises. You are talking about the car your wife wants and the cost doesn't really matter. The rest of us aren't look at the same equation.


As for the fuel mileage issue, isn't "combined driving" an attempt to make the number closer to what you will experience, but still an EPA protocal? That means when you follow the EPA standard, you will get 34 with they way they combine driving. Getting less than that only means you either drive more in the city or with more of a lead foot. Who can imagine a lead foot in a turbo charged MINI, Plaz?

[lemming]

I'm averaging 30 combined so far, and I'm still on my second tank. I think it will probably get a little bit better as the engine loosens up some more.

But I don't think it will get to 34. And I just have Stage I.

if you're gettin' 30mpg on winter gas, you're doing really well.

[Plaz]

As for the fuel mileage issue, isn't "combined driving" an attempt to make the number closer to what you will experience, but still an EPA protocal? That means when you follow the EPA standard, you will get 34 with they way they combine driving. Getting less than that only means you either drive more in the city or with more of a lead foot. Who can imagine a lead foot in a turbo charged MINI, Plaz?

:eeps:

[FC]

In your case, you aren't talking about compromises. You are talking about the car your wife wants and the cost doesn't really matter. The rest of us aren't look at the same equation.

Fair enough. But IMO, the MCS would rarely be worth the compromising if you really need soemthing else. It's such a different car that the 1er would be bigger/different. I guess I would never make the compromise for a MCS. If I needed something bigger/RWD/whatever, I'd get something like that and 30 vs 35K would not make that big a difference to jump from one type of car to the other. Now, a 25K MCS vs a 35K MCS? I can see that.

But I'm notin that boat, so I don't really know.

[lemming]

Fair enough. But IMO, the MCS would rarely be worth the compromising if you really need soemthing else. It's such a different car that the 1er would be bigger/different. I guess I would never make the compromise for a MCS. If I needed something bigger/RWD/whatever, I'd get something like that and 30 vs 35K would not make that big a difference to jump from one type of car to the other. Now, a 25K MCS vs a 35K MCS? I can see that.

But I'm notin that boat, so I don't really know.

i just have this little bird (from this goddamn place) chirping in my ear about how loaded cars lose more value (and this is obvious) than lightly optioned cars simply because the options don't retain their value as well as the core car does.

in my mudgeon point of view, to pay for things i won't use or to pay for things that will break irritates me. i don't use the NAV that came with the car but it was simply too hard to find a BRgreen car with an LSD.

this time 'round, i'm just going to order exactly what i'll use and want in the car. might have to go hopping and Skip-ing to do it, though. :eeps: (a penske a day keeps the doctor away).

:lol:

[Plaz]

Sarafil:
http://simplyawful.com/pics/chaching.jpg

:lol:

[SARAFIL]

Sarafil:
http://simplyawful.com/pics/chaching.jpg

:lol:


:eeps:




:bigpimp:

[lemming]

:handwringing OFF:

how many times in life can you say that you spend the almost exact same amount for a car and get one that's 'faster'?

[SARAFIL]

"150" ... anyone know what that means?

:D

[FC]

Your allocation of JCW MCS's? :dunno:

[lemming]

that's some secret handshake speak, i bet.

order of the Illuminati and such.

[JST]

that's some secret handshake speak, i bet.

order of the Illuminati and such.

Do we get to see pictures of this one?

[Plaz]

Your pre-printed Documentation Fee? :lol:

[ff]

Congrats lemming :cool:

[JST]

Your pre-printed Documentation Fee? :lol:

Hey, that would be a bargain in VA.

[Plaz]

Hey, that would be a bargain in VA.

Yeah, mine was higher too.

Is 150 "scheduled for production?"

Let's hear the specifics, lem!

[lemming]

Yeah, mine was higher too.

Is 150 "scheduled for production?"

Let's hear the specifics, lem!

it's a long story. but i will. shortly.

:cool:

[SARAFIL]

No, it's not the doc fee... we are capped at $95 by RI law.



Is 150 "scheduled for production?"



We have a winner!!

[lemming]

the standard MCS is a tight little car.

i was looking to change three things:

1. the JCWorks car colors look awesome, so i want 'em --it did not help that the same color combo is sitting in a showroom and it looks flat out great. chili red with white stripes looks too Hollywood to me. chili red with black stripes looks cool to me. 'thought i'd love the BRgreen, but it actually looks really boring and frumpy.

2. the standard headlights are annoyingly bad (is my eyesight fading?).

3. i don't dislike the NAV, but i have no use for it.

in addition, it's a game of diminishing returns. the stage I kit is $2100 and bumps 172hp/177ft# to 189/192; the JCWorks car is 207hp/207ft#'s. :dunno: --> $123/hp versus $214/hp.

there's nothing really sane about this other than having the car i should have been pickier about in the very beginning. i've made the commitment, in the face of $4 a gallon gas, to keep the MINI. now i'm just trying to get the one that i really like.

[FC]

Awesome!

[Plaz]

Obviously, I think you're a smart man. :lol:

Congrats!

So, what's the config on the order?

[lemming]

don't remember all of the details as i had a Sales Manager config the car.

i think it's:
LSD
Xenon
CWP
Prem
DSC

no bluefang. no steinway trim.

[SARAFIL]

don't remember all of the details as i had a Sales Manager config the car.


I love customers like that that give me a blank check to order them whatever I want them to get! Any clue where I can find one?

Oh, wait a minute... :eeps:




:D

[SARAFIL]

Obviously, I think you're a smart man. :lol:

Congrats!

So, what's the config on the order?

I'd be willing to bet that he got:

Chili Red with black roof and stripes
chrome-line exterior
black leatherette
white turn signal lights
rear fog lights
premium pack
cold weather pack
multi-function steering wheel
xenons
DSC
LSD
JCW kit

not sure if I'm missing something but that seems to be what I would expect...

[Plaz]

I'd be willing to bet that he got:

Chili Red with black roof and stripes
chrome-line exterior
black leatherette
white turn signal lights
rear fog lights
premium pack
cold weather pack
multi-function steering wheel
xenons
DSC
LSD
JCW kit

not sure if I'm missing something but that seems to be what I would expect...

:lol:

Excellent. Nice config!

The brootoof really is very cool, tho. :eeps: :lol:

[JST]

:lol:

Excellent. Nice config!

The brootoof really is very cool, tho. :eeps: :lol:

The black leatherette is what I have, and I have to say if there is one thing I am nervous about, it is what that leatherette is going to feel like in the summer. Cloth seemed like a bad option with a young kid, but that might be my one source of regret as my ownership wears on.

[Plaz]

The black leatherette is what I have, and I have to say if there is one thing I am nervous about, it is what that leatherette is going to feel like in the summer. Cloth seemed like a bad option with a young kid, but that might be my one source of regret as my ownership wears on.

That was my biggest rationale for getting the punch leather. I know it will breathe, probably even better than the lounge leather would.

I hate getting a sweaty back in an air-conditioned car in summer. Bleech.

[FC]

For all my love of 'ette, I haven't had 'ette in a car since my 190E that was sold three years ago. I do remember it being uncomfortable inthe summer, but back when I had it, I had no garage. I don't remember it being that big a deal, but maybe I'm forgetting the bad times.

[equ]

Congrats, Lemming! Can't wait to see pics.

[Plaz]

Opted to skip the sports suspension, too, huh?

[ff]

Premium Pkg doesn't come with leather seats?

[lemming]

Opted to skip the sports suspension, too, huh?

yup.

not sure yet if i want that full time. the car already crashes around on these godawful roads.

for me, i'm not smart enough yet to know (i'd need Snyde and JV to weigh in) if i'd like more roll control as opposed to slamming the car down a little bit. i think the damping is good, but maybe a rear that will tighten up and swing out a little more? that sounds more like swaybars.

leather seats? not worth the money to me. i went through last summer with the 'ette and it was normal. i didn't notice anything and the car is never garaged (home or work).

*now about that midnight blue C6 LS3 vert.........

[FC]

yup.

not sure yet if i want that full time. the car already crashes around on these godawful roads.

for me, i'm not smart enough yet to know (i'd need Snyde and JV to weigh in) if i'd like more roll control as opposed to slamming the car down a little bit. i think the damping is good, but maybe a rear that will tighten up and swing out a little more? that sounds more like swaybars.

leather seats? not worth the money to me. i went through last summer with the 'ette and it was normal. i didn't notice anything and the car is never garaged (home or work).

If we get one we would also skip the sports suspension as well. You can always upgrade that later.

*now about that midnight blue C6 LS3 vert.........

Oooohh...

[Theo]

Congrats, Lemming! Can't wait to see pics.

Ditto. This site is now E9X and Mini central. Plaz did you get your new wheels installed?

[Plaz]

Ditto. This site is now E9X and Mini central. Plaz did you get your new wheels installed?

No, waiting another week or two... snow is still possible at this point.

[Theo]

No, waiting another week or two... snow is still possible at this point.

Well if it can snow in Texas it can snow anywhere. =P

[lemming]

No, waiting another week or two... snow is still possible at this point.

can't wait to get your impressions of running 17" wheels with nonRFTs. i'm happy enough with the 16" wheels because there is much rubber between the road and the wheel it's damn hard to bend 'em on these awful roads.

but the enkeis are so reasonable that if you them, i might get them, too.

and then rope JeSTer into getting them, rope FC into getting an MCS......

[FC]

...and then rope JeSTer into getting them, rope FC into getting an MCS......

After some thought and discussions, I have gained some clarity on what we should in our garage long term.

I'll just say my wife's comment was, "there is always room for a Mini." We are probably still a couple of years away from one, but if ED becomes available for the MCS, we'd probably get one next spring.

[lemming]

After some thought and discussions, I have gained some clarity on what we should in our garage long term.

I'll just say my wife's comment was, "there is always room for a Mini." We are probably still a couple of years away from one, but if ED becomes available for the MCS, we'd probably get one next spring.

http://www.northamericanmotoring.com/forums/showthread.php?t=120528&highlight=JCW+dyno

i guess i've seen several dyno plots now where the MCS with the JCW stage I kit is putting ~180hp/~200ft# to the WHEELS.

for a little 1.6L hamster motor, that's pretty cool. for only 2600 lbs, that is decent power to weight ratio, too.

[Rob]

Well, I will just throw in that the e90 keeps getting better and better. I didnt' get to drive it this weekend, so I am still stuck at about 1100 miles, but the motor is smoothing out, settling down, and sounding better all the time. True, it's not as thrifty as a MINI. But torque everywhere is a compelling argument.

[FC]

Well, I will just throw in that the e90 keeps getting better and better. I didnt' get to drive it this weekend, so I am still stuck at about 1100 miles, but the motor is smoothing out, settling down, and sounding better all the time. True, it's not as thrifty as a MINI. But torque everywhere is a compelling argument.

2600lbs/200lb-ft = 13lbs/lb-ft
3600(?)lbs/300lb-ft = 12lbs/lb-ft

...and similarly flat torque curves, right?

I would like to see how these both feel relative to one another. JST, you're the closest one. And no, I'm not arguing they are equally fast.

[lemming]

2600lbs/200lb-ft = 13lbs/lb-ft
3600(?)lbs/300lb-ft = 12lbs/lb-ft

...and similarly flat torque curves, right?

I would like to see how these both feel relative to one another. JST, you're the closest one. And no, I'm not arguing they are equally fast.

:lol:

they're probably not even close!

based on my experience with high torque V8 sleds, the MCS isn't even close --some of that power is lost right from the start because the front wheels are scrabbling for traction. but 1.6Litres still feels like 1.6litres. you can feel the engine working and straining.

i don't think one could say that about the 3.0TT powerplant. i doubt it ever really strains during acceleration.

:)

[ff]

but 1.6Litres still feels like 1.6litres. you can feel the engine working and straining.

:yes:

[FC]

:lol:

they're probably not even close!

based on my experience with high torque V8 sleds, the MCS isn't even close --some of that power is lost right from the start because the front wheels are scrabbling for traction. but 1.6Litres still feels like 1.6litres. you can feel the engine working and straining.

i don't think one could say that about the 3.0TT powerplant. i doubt it ever really strains during acceleration.

:)

No kidding, the 335i is a sub 5 second car, no? The JCW MCS will only hopefully break 6 seconds. I was talking more about the torquey nature.

Hey, at least the MCS has an LSD.;)

OT: Speaking of the 3.0TT, I saw last night that the spread between MSPR and ED invoice on a 535xiT wagon is $8K. That kind of savings makes that wagon a whole lot more reasonable.

I may have to drive one just to see what the engine feels like in an AWD wagon.

[Rob]

Well, fwiw, I wouldn't care if the MINI was faster. I am just digging the e90 atm. And I feel like a complete hypocrit b/c of it after the way I reacted to the interior.

[lemming]

Well, fwiw, I wouldn't care if the MINI was faster. I am just digging the e90 atm. And I feel like a complete hypocrit b/c of it after the way I reacted to the interior.

nah. it's normal. i think most of us really like the e30 and e36 interiors so the e90 takes some getting used to.

i hate the MINI interior, but that's me.

[Plaz]

My MCS certainly seems to be opening up a little in the engine power department, now that it's got 1000 miles or so on it... it's definitely running more smoothly, and pulling harder. Honestly, I'm sure it probably isn't, but it feels as fast as my 330 was.

[JST]

2600lbs/200lb-ft = 13lbs/lb-ft
3600(?)lbs/300lb-ft = 12lbs/lb-ft

...and similarly flat torque curves, right?

I would like to see how these both feel relative to one another. JST, you're the closest one. And no, I'm not arguing they are equally fast.

Well, it's a bit hard to compare because of the Mini's "aggressive" throttle map, particularly in sport mode. But I'd say that the Mini does feel zippier right off the line in most driving, a function of it's 1000 lb weight advantage and a motor with an incredibly rapid turbo spool-up. Of course, the 335 has a LOT more top end, and if you wring the 335 out it will hand the Mini its pants even from a stand-still (as long as you can get the power down, of course).

[lemming]

Well, it's a bit hard to compare because of the Mini's "aggressive" throttle map, particularly in sport mode. But I'd say that the Mini does feel zippier right off the line in most driving, a function of it's 1000 lb weight advantage and a motor with an incredibly rapid turbo spool-up. Of course, the 335 has a LOT more top end, and if you wring the 335 out it will hand the Mini its pants even from a stand-still (as long as you can get the power down, of course).

it's really fun to drive every day.

i didn't think i'd like it this much, but it's a cool commutah cahr.

i keep trying to get the lil sucker to spin but it's pretty wide and that is proving difficult to do (wet parking lots).

[FC]

Well, it's a bit hard to compare because of the Mini's "aggressive" throttle map, particularly in sport mode. But I'd say that the Mini does feel zippier right off the line in most driving, a function of it's 1000 lb weight advantage and a motor with an incredibly rapid turbo spool-up. Of course, the 335 has a LOT more top end, and if you wring the 335 out it will hand the Mini its pants even from a stand-still (as long as you can get the power down, of course).

And that's the vanilla MCS. Add 20% more hp and 15% more torque for the JCW/MCS.

The question for me, is how does 235hp/222lb-ft in the ~3400lb 330i compare with 210hp/200lb-ft in the ~2700 JCW/MCS.

[lemming]

And that's the vanilla MCS. Add 20% more hp and 15% more torque for the JCW/MCS.

The question for me, is how does 235hp/222lb-ft in the ~3400lb 330i compare with 210hp/200lb-ft in the ~2700 JCW/MCS.

you're more than welcome to find out --in the standard MCS and then a JCW Stage I.

it's not a lot of excess power for merging, though, i'll tell you that much.

mostly it's a lot of power in the midrange that is shocking for a 1.6L motor, especially on the highway.