Poll - What should I do....

[Josh (PA)]

So as I mentioned in an earlier thread, the wagon has been acting up quite a lot lately. Some has been my fault (big spider in the car spooked me and I hit a curb), others the fault of a BMW with 130k miles, but in summary I've had to put in average $650 / month in maintenance (including tires) since August. In November it threw it's aux belt that drives the water pump, power steering, etc. When I had that replaced, I had the water pump done. Last week, the replacement water pump crapped out and stranded me on the side of the road. My mechanic graciously covered the water pump and labor under warranty, and I got the car back Wednesday. Thursday the belt driven cooling fan catastrophically failed and sent shrapnel through everything: hoses, expansion tank, transmission thermostat, even denting the hood. I just got it back today, and everything seems to be working (for now). I'm not sure what the final total for this latest episode will be, my mechanic blames himself for not replacing the fan clutch when the second water pump went bad, but at the same time I appreciate him trying to keep my maintenance bills down. I expect it will be a parts at cost deal with discounted labor... we'll see.

So here is my dilemna, and I would like to hear your opinions:

Financially prior to the latest breakdowns, our plan was to to keep the wagon for one more year. We'd really like to stick to that plan as long as the maintenance bills don't continue at the pace they've been piling up for the last 5 months. We also love the wagon when it is working and can't find anything that remotely meets our needs as well to replace it with. We have a 2yr old, an 8 yr old, a 9 yr old, 2 dogs, a canoe and skis that routinely pile into or on top of the car comfortably. We also now have a go kart and lawn tractor that I could easily tow behind the wagon if I added a hit and a 5*9 trailor.

We drove the 335i last weekend and were very impressed, but we'd lease if we went that route. We're very leary of leasing and worry about the potential hidden costs, the mileage restrictions and whether or not we get nickle and dimed at turn in. It has a back seat that would fit our 3 kids about as well as the wagon, and would guarantee no maintenance bills for the life of our lease. If we did this, we'd probalby wind up spending an extra $8k - $10k on a POS Chrysler Towne and Country to do our sh*t work and haul extra kids in.

We will probably drive a 330i ZHP this weekend with the thought that we could get one with a year of warranty left and have a pretty reliable used car going forward. I'm a little concerned with the size of the back seat to comfortably hold 1 forward facing car seat and two pre-teen girls. Same thing here, we'd probably add a minivan to the stable to make up the hauling capabilities of the wagon.

So the question is: What would you do? Stay on your financial plan and hope that you've already replaced everything on the wagon that could possibly fail (Yes I know the tranny will probably be next). Lease a 335i and enjoy the peace of mind that there will never ever be a maintenance bill? Get a used end of production E46 and hope that all the bugs are worked out??? Just for fun, another data point is either of the 3 series would save us about $100/month in gas assuming it is 33% more efficient than our 15mpg wagon.

[wdc330i]

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=256455

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[Josh (PA)]

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=256455

?

This option has been bounced around a lot as well. If we love the car as much as we think we do, why not just get a newer, lower mileage one. I just don't trust owning BMW V8s for a long period of time. I guess if we went that route and only planned on keeping it for 30 or 40k miles it would be good, but as an example when the wagon was in for the latest water pump, my mechanic had two E38s in for cooling system problems, and one that he worked on recently at the local dealer with a radiator leak... I just don't want to repeat what I've gone through for the last 5 months.

It's partially the cost black hole, but more the concern that everytime I start the car up something will be broken, or everytime I go somewhere I might not make it home.

[bren]

I'd most likely stay the course - with AAA card in hand. :p

[JST]

WRT your question about lease turn ins, I have turned in 3 leased BMWs so far, and have never had to pay any extra charges. I treat my cars pretty well, but am not anal--minor dents, scrapes etc. Have never been an issue.

[Josh (PA)]

This option has been bounced around a lot as well. If we love the car as much as we think we do, why not just get a newer, lower mileage one. I just don't trust owning BMW V8s for a long period of time. I guess if we went that route and only planned on keeping it for 30 or 40k miles it would be good, but as an example when the wagon was in for the latest water pump, my mechanic had two E38s in for cooling system problems, and one that he worked on recently at the local dealer with a radiator leak... I just don't want to repeat what I've gone through for the last 5 months.

It's partially the cost black hole, but more the concern that everytime I start the car up something will be broken, or everytime I go somewhere I might not make it home.

Tried editing this post, but it's not working.

I just found this particular '03 540iT on Autotrader in Cali. It is about perfect... and includes the extended warranty
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=235937042&dealer_id=1331371&car_year=2003&model=540IT&num_records=25&systime=&make2=&start_year=2001&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&engine=&certified=&body_code=0&fuel=&awsp=false&search_type=both&distance=0&marketZipError=false&search_lang=en&make=BMW&keywords_display=&color=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&min_price=&drive=&default_sort=priceDESC&max_mileage=&style_flag=2&sort_type=priceDESC&address=19335&advanced=y&end_year=2005&doors=&transmission=&max_price=&cardist=2371

[Sharp11]

I'm not so certain the ZHP is a good choice for a family with preteens.

Instead of a van plus a 335i, how would a lightly used 528/535i wagon work? It'd be around 38 or 39 and likely have the CPO warranty. It's not as controversial in terms of styling as its sedan counterpart and would solve your cargo needs. There was a nice wagon at the local dealer recently, with awd (535xi) 14k miles for 43k.

As for staying with your current car another year - it's probably a wash financially, you've put so much into it already, but it's pretty clear you've lost some peace of mind. You'll be paying for cars most of the rest of your life, one way or another, so it's best to get what you really want as long as it's not too much a stretch - you don't seem like the type of guy who throws his cars away too often (unlike moi and some of the others here :lol:).

Ed

[Rob]

Sell! BUY! Sell! Buy!! Oh, wait, that's me.

Fwiw, I have committed to keep the e90 for at least 100k barring any catastorphic occurrences (and I have been told that getting bored doesn't count - only frame bending accidents). We will buy the extended warranty, keep the car until the warranty is up, and make decisions about what next based on its reliability and oil analyses. So our outlay for most repairs will be limited - ndecent piece of mind with what the e90 is.

I am aware that I could replace everything that needs replacing on the e36 for the amount of money we will spend on the e90. Twice. At the end of the day, that's not the point when its your daily driver and you really enjoy driving.

If you are really interested in an e46, run some imaginary scenarios of what the cost of ownership might be. It might help you make up your mind.

[Josh (PA)]

I'm not so certain the ZHP is a good choice for a family with preteens.

Instead of a van plus a 335i, how would a lightly used 528/535i wagon work? It'd be around 38 or 39 and likely have the CPO warranty. Ed

I spent a lot of time with an e60 530xiT about a year ago when my mother had one as a loaner and didn't like it at all. The ergonomics were horrible and the driving experience seemed forced. Now a 535iT without x drive and with a stick on the other hand... If only it existed.

We will buy the extended warranty, keep the car until the warranty is up, and make decisions about what next based on its reliability and oil analyses. So our outlay for most repairs will be limited

How is the extended warranty? I've had CPO cars in the past and been disappointed with what isn't covered. Is the extended warranty the same as the new car warranty ie: suspension bushings and other "wear" items are covered or does it only cover major drivetrain failures? That would really make the Cali wagon interesting if it had the same as new car warranty through 2012

[SARAFIL]

How is the extended warranty? I've had CPO cars in the past and been disappointed with what isn't covered. Is the extended warranty the same as the new car warranty ie: suspension bushings and other "wear" items are covered or does it only cover major drivetrain failures? That would really make the Cali wagon interesting if it had the same as new car warranty through 2012

CPO does not cover wear items... so bushings, trim, accessories (they put your audio/navigation systems in this area) are not covered. Also, there is a $50 deductible per visit. But all the major stuff that you spoke about going wrong on your car should be covered-- the fan, water pump, alternator, etc.

By the way, the warranty on that '03 in California CAN NOT possibly be the CPO warranty. It says good through 8/2012... CPO is good for 6 years from the in service date, which would mean this car was sold new in 2006?? Also, it is not $0 deductible. Sounds like this is an aftermarket warranty, so I'd be very cautious about it. Some of them can be good, but alot can be a major PITA so be careful.

[Plaz]

OMFG, if it's this car that did that to your wrist, I would not blame you one bit for ejecting it from your life on that basis alone. Damn! Ouch!

[Josh (PA)]

OMFG, if it's this car that did that to your wrist, I would not blame you one bit for ejecting it from your life on that basis alone. Damn! Ouch!


I was going to pick up my son last Monday when the water pump started puking and rushed getting the cap open in a feeble attempt to add water and keep it on the road. Needless to say, I f-ed myself. It is healing surprisingly well considering that's what it looked like a week and a half ago.

[Josh (PA)]

CPO does not cover wear items... so bushings, trim, accessories (they put your audio/navigation systems in this area) are not covered. Also, there is a $50 deductible per visit. But all the major stuff that you spoke about going wrong on your car should be covered-- the fan, water pump, alternator, etc.

By the way, the warranty on that '03 in California CAN NOT possibly be the CPO warranty. It says good through 8/2012... CPO is good for 6 years from the in service date, which would mean this car was sold new in 2006?? Also, it is not $0 deductible. Sounds like this is an aftermarket warranty, so I'd be very cautious about it. Some of them can be good, but alot can be a major PITA so be careful.


Thanks for the info. What's the deal with extending the original new car warranty. Is it possible through BMW, or are they always from an outside source?

[ZBB]

Its always a tough decision when the average monthly maint cost is close to the payments on something new.

I went through it on my first car -- and sold it the day after I picked it up from the service guy after a string of visits every month or two that averaged more than the payment on the replacement car.

I'm going through it now too. I was looking to replace my '03 530 with a CTS, but needed to find a window where I would have time to sell the 530 just after getting the CTS on order -- since I travel a lot for work, I never found the time. Unfortunately, the delay meant that it just required an Inspection II. I was also having some bad misfire issues that required new spark plugs, which is not covered on the CPO warranty.

So after the recent maintenance cost, I've decided to keep the 530 for about another year. I'm going to get a couple new tires in a few weeks -- fortunately I only need to replace two -- one was replaced last spring and the spare was rotated in then. Its still under CPO until March of '09, so any major failures should be covered (and I already have one -- the drivers side HID low beam went out this week).

[SARAFIL]

Thanks for the info. What's the deal with extending the original new car warranty. Is it possible through BMW, or are they always from an outside source?

BMW offers two types of "warranty extensions":

-CPO, only applicable if you are buying the car through a BMW dealer, or if the vehicle was previously sold as a CPO car through a BMW dealer and still carries the balance of this warranty

-"Original Owner Protection Program" gives the same warranty coverage/terms as CPO but is offered to the original vehicle owner... basically if you bought your BMW new and want an extended warranty through BMW. This warranty is transferable, but can not be purchased if you are not the 1st owner of the car.

[Rob]

How is the extended warranty? I've had CPO cars in the past and been disappointed with what isn't covered. Is the extended warranty the same as the new car warranty ie: suspension bushings and other "wear" items are covered or does it only cover major drivetrain failures? That would really make the Cali wagon interesting if it had the same as new car warranty through 2012

You know, I was sort of assuming the dealer would offer an extended warranty b/c they all offer them and they all make money on them. I haven't researched it yet, but from what Sarafil says, it sounds like it will be the CPO warrant - that warranty is good enough for peace of mind for me. I don't expect things like bushings to be covered. I do expect things like turbos to be covered. And electronic brake drying systems. And . . . you get the idea. We got a pretty good extended warranty for the van (we BETTER keep that damn thing at least long enough to need it and it has lots of switches and electric motors and stuff). I guess I just expected a similar option.

[Josh (PA)]

Well after a couple of weeks of waffling, I am pretty much set on a plan. A disappointing plan, but a plan none the less. While I loved the 335i, the idea of 3 cars, or more accurately 3 car expenses, just isn't justifiable. Logic strongly recommended I stomach an MDX, so today we went driving. I think we're pretty much settled on a 2004 MDX Touring with Nav. It isn't fun, but it definitely is practical and practical is what we need for the time being. Driving impression is as follows: ok it is not *that* bad. Seats are comfortable enough, it doesn't roll like a crab boat in the Alaskan Sea, it has enough power to merge into traffic safely and everything I've read suggests bullet proof reliability. We'll make our final call this week, but I think we have a winner....whoopee.

[FC]

Best of luck!

[Josh (PA)]

If you keep the car long enough, the maintenance cost, while still expensive, will have a lesser impact on your per mile cost versus leasing, ASSuming that the car doesn't kick the bucket, or someone totals it for you.


That has been my experience in the past but not with the wagon. $600 something on average a month in maintenance bills for 6+ months threw the ASSumption right out the window.

[Theo]

But, I have had it for 140 to 150K (E30 reliable odometer, heh), so even with all the expenses, the mileage brought down my per mile cost to where I can't find a car that can give me anything remotely close to its 10 cent per mile.

wow. The most I ever put on one car was like 60K and that was my MR2 I had for 6+ years.

How long have you had it?