E46 high-mileage preventative maintenance

[rumatt]

Hey E46 experts... can I get your advice? I think I might want to keep the car for a while longer and I'm trying to figure out if I should put some money into preventative maintenance. The car has 160K miles and I have done almost nothing other than change the oil. The water pump also went at some point a long, long time ago.

The car has been shockingly reliable. I'm almost scared to touch anything.

Option 1: Do absolutely nothing. Drive it until it break down, then push it into a river somewhere.

Option 2: Change the important stuff? Maybe transmission fluid? But even that I'm reading not to touch it unless the shop knows what they're doing.

Option 3: Add an LSD, and while in there change a bunch of bushings, etc.

I'm leaning toward 1 or 3. Ie, either do nothing or commit to it for the long haul, in which case I'm getting an LSD. The problem is I can't do this work so I'm looking at paying for everything at market labor rates. I think I'm OK with that.


The motor burns 1 quart of oil per 1000 miles. That kind of worries me. I'll get an oil analysis when I change my oil in 1000 miles.
.

[TD]

I realize I don't remember anything about your E46 aside other than you've had it seemingly forever. I'm going to follow this thread as the advice may well apply to the E39 I'm stuck with.

[rumatt]

I realize I don't remember anything about your E46 aside other than you've had it seemingly forever.

2003 330i w/6-speed. Light blue, sports package and folding rear seat. No other options

Lots of autocrosses, one track day

Front bumper lower lip broken off

Rear bumper lower bumper broken off

Drivers seat starting to crack apart (despite being leatherette which is supposed to last forever)

Steering wheel worn down at 9 and 3.

ZHP knob leather completely worn off. Went back to stock wood knob.

Lots of play in front control arms. Doesn't seem to bug me while driving.

Had DA koni shocks on for a while. The rears fell apart. Fronts are still on (I think!?)

Zero clunks, rattles or funny noises at all while driving. It's been an incredible car.

[Plaz]

The motor burns 1 quart of oil per 1000 miles.

:ack:

Head gasket?

I considered adding an LSD to my E46 when I had it, but concluded the compromises and expense were not worth it for a non-tracked car. Maybe circumstances are different now though.

[Josh (PA)]

I vote option 1. I'll let those more informed weigh in, but my assumption is when you say done very little, that means no struts, expansion tanks, bushings, etc. I think to do #3 right at an indy shop would be $10k for all of it to be right. That would be a half year lease on a new m3.

[TD]

I don't see it as that black and white. I think Matt's in the city and probably doesn't drive much. So investing in a new car gets tough to justify. When you know where this one's been and that it was a "good example" that hasn't had issues, fixing everything with the intent to keep it for another decade isn't necessarily a bad idea.

I just fixed about half of everything on the E39 (spending more than I'd be able to sell it for) to make it solidly reliable again - without addressing a bunch of cosmetic issues or the worn out shocks.

[rumatt]

When you know where this one's been and that it was a "good example" that hasn't had issues, fixing everything with the intent to keep it for another decade isn't necessarily a bad idea.

Right, that's my dilemma. The scary thing is that it could potentially require everything within the next few years. Engine work, clutch, bushings, shocks. etc. The thing that scares me the most is the engine work.

I still kind of want to do it anyway for some reason. :dunno: :confused:

[Plaz]

160K city miles... how could those bushings and shocks have anything left? Are your front strut towers still non-deformed?

NYC killed my E46. Granted, I had PSS9s in it and they were set far too stiff and low because I was dumb. But still.

[Jeff_DML]

I vote 1. No offense but doesn’t seem worth putting money into. I guess the head gasket should be cheap to check/replace if that is your oil burning issue.

[Nick M3]

Changing the fluids is not a bad thing. It's only the automatics where there is some thought that it might be better to leave it alone. (Which is debated. The theory is that fresh fluid breaks off gunk which clogs up the valve body and other small orifices. A manual doesn't have any of that.)

Edit: Also, at this point, who knows how much fluid has leaked out of your transmission and diff. Changing the fluid might at least give peace of mind that they are full. :p

Beyond that, eventually the rest of your cooling system will fail. At least change the expansion tank. I'd change the radiator and hoses too.

[rumatt]

Are your front strut towers still non-deformed?

They were. At one point I banged them back to flat and installed a reinforcement plate. I may have even made a thread about it?

I vote 1. No offense but doesn’t seem worth putting money into.

Its definitely not a pristine example, but it does really look quite reasonable (other than what I mentioned) and it still drives great. I really like driving it.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160513/8c97a0c12a3efd6c377e846f7d73f516.jpg

[rumatt]

Beyond that, eventually the rest of your cooling system will fail. At least change the expansion tank. I'd change the radiator and hoses too.

What about the engine burning oil? And does anything scare you about these engines as they approach 200k miles?

A grand here and there is still way cheaper than a new car. A full new engine + clutch + suspension + bushings? Hmm, I'm probably ready to give up the car before that.

[Nick M3]

A quart every thousand is inside BMW guidelines. :p

Try thicker oil if you care.

Engines are cheap. The car is basically worthless anyway - if the engine dies, sell it as a parts car for $2k. It's probably only worth $3-4K right now anyway.

[rumatt]

The car is basically worthless anyway

Good point. :lol:

[Jeff_DML]

Its definitely not a pristine example, but it does really look quite reasonable (other than what I mentioned) and it still drives great. I really like driving it.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160513/8c97a0c12a3efd6c377e846f7d73f516.jpg

yes looks nice,:cool:

I was more talking about getting the money back out of it if you sell it. Like nick said not worth a lot.

[FC]

I easily vote for running it into the ground. An E46 with a decent body has to be worth something even if it stops running. What is the book value on it now?

[rumatt]

I easily vote for running it into the ground. An E46 with a decent body has to be worth something even if it stops running. What is the book value on it now?

Edmunds says ~$3100. :ack:

But my steel blue paint bumps the value by $2.00. :bustingup

[ZBB]

My E46 was an '01 325Ci, but was also steel blue with tan (although I had leather…). I traded it just shy of 4 years on the '03 E39 in Feb '05. I think I got $19k for it. I kept the E39 for about 3.5 years -- got rid of it since it had issues (while the E46 was relatively issue-free…)

I happened to see an E46 coupe this morning -- possibly even my car, or a twin. Looked like it was in great shape. Now you post pics of yours… Great looking car. Memories...

Anyway. I vote #1...

[Sharp11]

What about the engine burning oil? And does anything scare you about these engines as they approach 200k miles?

A grand here and there is still way cheaper than a new car. A full new engine + clutch + suspension + bushings? Hmm, I'm probably ready to give up the car before that.

At 160K, you can expect higher levels of oil consumption.

If I were you, I'd replace fluids and suspension bushings and wait for anything else until it fails.

[3LOU5]

The increased oil usage can be attributed to a clogged CCV.

My 2002 E46 has 137k miles and uses a little less than a quart every 7500 miles. I've been meaning to replace my original CCV, but I've heard it's quite a PITA. I'm going to wait a little longer until the oil usage gets ridiculously high.

So far, besides fluid changes, I've overhauled the cooling system twice as preventive maintenance, replaced the fuel pump/fuel filter once, replaced 2 window regulators, replaced lower control arms, replaced the VCG and DISA valve, replaced oil level sender "thingie" (located on the bottom of the oil pan), replaced brake rotors and pads on all 4 corners twice.....I think that's about it.

IMO, I think that's pretty good. As I've said before, I'm going to keep this car until the last bolt falls off the thing. Driving it today gives me the same pleasure it gave me when I first drove her off the lot almost 14 years ago (wow, has it been THAT long ?!?!).

[equ]

Matt, do you commute (reverse) from Manhattan to Westchester every day?

[rumatt]

The increased oil usage can be attributed to a clogged CCV.

Oh man, maybe. I did notice some yellowish goo on my oil cap a while back. Then it magical went away. Apparently that's an early warning sign of CCV issues.

Matt, do you commute (reverse) from Manhattan to Westchester every day?

No not every day. I work from home sometimes, I stay up there sometimes. It varies. But the majority of the driving I do is to/from the city. When I'm staying up there my commute is 3 miles.

I have a 1 car garage that could house a garage queen if I decide to go that direction.

[Alan]

I would go with number one but what the heck do I know :dunno:

Your car looks good in that picture, nice looking wheels too, I always liked that color.


btw it sounds like I've done more maintenance to my 4 year old car than you did to your 13 year old car :eek:

[Sharp11]

Besides, Matt's a little late getting into the "high mileage preventative maintenance worry" routine, he's already dodged the bullet at 160k :)

[Josh (PA)]

Yellowish goo is usually just the oil not getting hot and some condensation not cooking off.

Based on its reliability to date, your itch for something new anyway, and the relative value of the car vs what you're considering spending on it, I really think #1 until it gets too expensive to fix or your itch for something else gets too strong to ignore. For the price of an installed lsd, you could pick up a beater cherokee for winter/bike transport.

[equ]

I would do fluids if you plan on another two years with it, but that's me. Gearbox, brake, coolant.

You can do fuel filter, coils/plugs if you get issues with how it runs.

I go to an indie. No loaners and the waiting room is not nice or anything but he's near the train station and since 2012 or so has always done good work for reasonable prices. These include new clutch/flywheel for the e39 and coils/plugs (parts shipped from amazon) for the m3 as well as regular maintenance and some other fixes.

http://www.motorsportgmbh.com/

Or you could go to Euromeccanica in your neck of the woods/commute (Yonkers) and pay through the nose. He does have a classic jazz collection and old italian road bikes hanging off the ceiling to make the rape pass by somewhat more pleasantly. They also do good work, but $$$$.

[rumatt]

I go to an indie. No loaners and the waiting room is not nice or anything but he's near the train station and since 2012 or so has always done good work for reasonable prices. These include new clutch/flywheel for the e39 and coils/plugs (parts shipped from amazon) for the m3 as well as regular maintenance and some other fixes.

http://www.motorsportgmbh.com/.

Great to know, thank you.

I have a shop up by me that I trust to not rip me off (very important!) but they're pretty expensive and not really BMW specialists. For small stuff they're fine though.

[John V]

It burns oil because of the CCV system. This is an easy fix, but it costs money, so maybe you don't want to bother.

Loose control arms would bother me. It doesn't bother you. :dunno: So don't touch it?

I know it's a long drive, but if you want to leave it with me for a couple weeks I'll fix everything you want and send you the bill :). On second thought, don't, it'll end up with an M50 manifold on it. :)

[Nick M3]

It burns oil because of the CCV system. This is an easy fix, but it costs money, so maybe you don't want to bother.

Loose control arms would bother me. It doesn't bother you. :dunno: So don't touch it?

I know it's a long drive, but if you want to leave it with me for a couple weeks I'll fix everything you want and send you the bill :). On second thought, don't, it'll end up with an M50 manifold on it. :)

You should do this, Matt.

[rumatt]

I know it's a long drive, but if you want to leave it with me for a couple weeks I'll fix everything you want and send you the bill :)
If you're serious, I'm in. :bigpimp:

How long can the list be? :speechle:

Seriously, I'm considering saying do just about everything possible. Including an LSD and I could have my Koni DA's sent back for a refresh (I think that's about the same price as new Koni SA's?)

No matter how expensive the E46 work is, it's cheaper than a new car, and it leave the door open for a second fun car if I want it.

[clyde]

If you're serious, I'm in. :bigpimp:

How long can the list be? :speechle:

Seriously, I'm considering saying do just about everything possible. Including an LSD and I could have my Koni DA's sent back for a refresh (I think that's about the same price as new Koni SA's?)

No matter how expensive the E46 work is, it's cheaper than a new car, and it leave the door open for a second fun car if I want it.

It would be awesome if some parts of a former D Stock National Championship winning car found their way onto a D Street Prepared National Championship winning car.

:eeps:

[rumatt]

It would be awesome if some parts of a former D Stock National Championship winning car found their way onto a D Street Prepared National Championship winning car.


Is this all a ploy by JV to source some extra stock parts? :lol:

[clyde]

Is this all a ploy by JV to source some extra stock parts? :lol:

Parts from "a good example."

[rumatt]

Beyond that, eventually the rest of your cooling system will fail. At least change the expansion tank. I'd change the radiator and hoses too.

Note to self. Next time listen to nick.

10991

[Nick M3]

Note to self. Next time listen to nick.

10991
Heh. Expansion tank unzip?

[rumatt]

Not sure. Heard an awful noise. Pulled over and antifreeze was pouring out. I didn't even look.

I was waiting until this fall and was going to have JV redo the cooling system. But the cooling system beat me to it.

This depending what my place quotes me this is going to be a tough call. I was just realizing yesterday that I'll likely never get out if my (steep) driveway this winter in this thing anyway.

[bren]

Park it at the bottom of the driveway and get some snowshoes. :)

[wdc330i]

Oy. Get a new car already, ;)

http://enthusiastauto.com/qsearch/?id=4715&form_display=51

Or wait for my 2012 auto wagon in Deep Sea Blue and have jv do a tranny swap.

[rumatt]

For some reason I want a wrx

[JST]

I assume because you've never driven one?

[rumatt]

I assume because you've never driven one?
:lol:








(correct)

[clyde]

:lol:








(correct)

:lol:

[rumatt]

right near my house (http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=439905017) :eeps:

[clyde]

right near my house (http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=439905017) :eeps:

Do you like listening to the sounds of exploding transmissions?

[rumatt]

Hadn't read that.

Read about crazy throttles though

[clyde]

Hadn't read that.

Read about crazy throttles though

I dont know how common it is. A DC local blew up his 2015's at a Pro last year. A 2011 (previous gen) blew up his launching next to me at this year's DC Pro.

[rumatt]

I try to branch out and consider a new car and you guys smack me back to reality :lol:

Thats it I'm keeping my car forever

[JST]

The WRX felt cheap and agricultural in 2004. I can't imagine it's gotten much better, but I haven't driven one in 10 years.

[Plaz]

I assume because you've never driven one?

:lol:

[rumatt]

The WRX felt cheap and agricultural in 2004. I can't imagine it's gotten much better, but I haven't driven one in 10 years.

I thought they're a bit better now.

What I want is a Audi S3 with a stick. Make it a wagon and I'll pay extra.

[bren]

I thought they're a bit better now.

What I want is a Audi S3 with a stick. Make it a wagon and I'll pay extra.

Isn't that a golf R?

[JST]

No, because hatchback.

[rumatt]

Isn't that a golf R?
If you had a garage door accident and chopped off the usable rear end of the vehicle, then yeah it's a golf R.

Here's my issue with the golf R. Under no circumstances will I go down a single vehicle that cannot comfortably house a large bicycle inside. It's not happening, and the golf R cannot.

So that means the R is purely a second car. And if I want an impractical sports car, is the R really what I buy? Really? E46 + Golf R > WRX + Cayman?

Hmmm. Maybe? :lol:

[JST]

Wait, a WRX will hold a bike? Huh.

[rumatt]

Wait, a WRX will hold a bike? Huh.
You think it won't?

[equ]

Love that front bumper..

If you're willing to spend about $250 to 500 you can have a tow hitch installed on almost any vehicle. It gets harder as you go up the sportiness chain, exhausts & diffusers & such.

I hate to look at porsches for sale a few months after buying mine, but there was an awesome sounding cayman S on pca. Black with red interior, LSD and sports options. Far, but worth it. Also 987.2 takes a nice, screw-in, bmw style base rack.

[rumatt]

Love that front bumper..

Interesting how I can find something wrong with every car that exists so I can't buy them, yet that bumper doesn't bother me, eh?

We're all a little cray cray. It just takes different forms :lol:

[kognito]

I was just realizing yesterday that I'll likely never get out if my (steep) driveway this winter in this thing anyway.

Make friends with someone across the street. Worked for me with my nasty ass driveway in NJ

[JST]

http://bringatrailer.com/listing/1998-bmw-m3-sedan-3/

[wdc330i]

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=30033&endYear=2017&modelCode1=BRAT&showcaseOwnerId=63544189&makeCode1=SUB&startYear=1981&firstRecord=0&searchRadius=0&showcaseListingId=435235335&mmt=%5BSUB%5BBRAT%5B%5D%5D%5B%5D%5D&listingId=435564292&Log=0

[bren]

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=30033&endYear=2017&modelCode1=BRAT&showcaseOwnerId=63544189&makeCode1=SUB&startYear=1981&firstRecord=0&searchRadius=0&showcaseListingId=435235335&mmt=%5BSUB%5BBRAT%5B%5D%5D%5B%5D%5D&listingId=435564292&Log=0

Ooh that's neat. Clyde put this on your auction cars to watch list.

[rumatt]

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=30033&endYear=2017&modelCode1=BRAT&showcaseOwnerId=63544189&makeCode1=SUB&startYear=1981&firstRecord=0&searchRadius=0&showcaseListingId=435235335&mmt=%5BSUB%5BBRAT%5B%5D%5D%5B%5D%5D&listingId=435564292&Log=0

:lol:

[rumatt]

Your water pump, water pump pulley, and both drive belts need to be replaced. If that is all the cost will run about $650 or so with parts and labor. There is another issue in that the expansion tank which is part of your cooling system is extremely delicate. If this breaks while disassembling it will need to be replaced. We will do the best we can of course not to have this happen. That part & labor runs about $240. This is a general estimate based on replacing water pump, pulley 2 belts, and/or expansion tank. We'll need approval to proceed.


I'm assuming I should tell them to do the expansion tank.

Anything else?

[bren]

Radiator? You'll probably need at least one (if not both) belt tensioners done too.

[rumatt]

Asked for a quote on the radiator too.

If I'm going to have JV work on the car later the radiator maybe isn't urgent right?

[bren]

Ask Nick. :eeps:

I don't know the rate at which they fail. We did the whole system on my father's car since it was easy enough as a "while you're in there" sort of thing. Not sure I would have done the same if it meant paying shop labor.

[rumatt]

They said they'll look at the expansion tank and radiator and if they look great they'll leave them. I said fine.

He seemed confused that I would replace a perfectly good part. :speechle:

[rumatt]

For what it's worth, my water pump failed at just 80K miles both times.

At least they are predictable.

[Plaz]

I went through three thermostats on my E46, and my wife has gone through two. Might want to check it.

[bren]

For what it's worth, my water pump failed at just 80K miles both times.

At least they are predictable.

I'm at 71k - guess I still have some time. :D

[wdc330i]

I went through three thermostats on my E46, and my wife has gone through two. Might want to check it.

How many miles do you have on that wagon now?

[Plaz]

How many miles do you have on that wagon now?

Not many. 60K-ish I think? 95% short drives around town. Not great for engine, but it's held up admirably.

[kognito]

Rumatt, just get one of these and stop waffleing for a while http://blog.caranddriver.com/2017-vw-golf-sportwagen-4motion-offers-awd-without-crossover-pretensions/

[John V]

They said they'll look at the expansion tank and radiator and if they look great they'll leave them. I said fine.

He seemed confused that I would replace a perfectly good part. :speechle:

The expansion tank is a little hard to judge by looks alone. I've seen ones that looked perfectly fine split open.

They're not that expensive to replace, but in the context of a high-mileage E46's book value I suppose every part is expensive :D

[wdc330i]

Not many. 60K-ish I think? 95% short drives around town. Not great for engine, but it's held up admirably.

Amazing! If it's a stick, you could probably get some $$ out of it from EA.

[rumatt]

Hi Mathew. You have a new water pump. Everything looks good. Our testing here shows the temperatures are ok and there is no visible leaking. The car is ready to be picked up. There is a concern due to scratches in the water pump housing due to the damaged waterpump we replaced. We want you to only drive locally in the next week with a close eye on the temperature gauge in order to be sure the housing damage will not effect your cooling system. I can explain better when you come in.


:speechle:

[bren]

They scratched the block? WTF is a water pump housing?

[rumatt]

Talked to them. They're saying they were worried about parts breaking off and possibly being in the cooling system.

And the "housing" is "what it connects to inside, to pump the water. It was scratched. Or something.

Fuck I don't know.

But I mentioned I might keep it a while and he said, "sure why not. It's the last good BMW and it's in great condition. Just keep putting engines in it. They'll just keep getting cheaper. For a while anyway." :lol"

[blee]

:lol:

[bren]

Was the pump missing blades? Ah whatever, best to just ignore it. :D

[Plaz]

Amazing! If it's a stick, you could probably get some $$ out of it from EA.

It's not. :lol:

[Plaz]

:lol:

:+1

[Alan]

I dont know how common it is. A DC local blew up his 2015's at a Pro last year. A 2011 (previous gen) blew up his launching next to me at this year's DC Pro.

I don't know much about this car but if you find one that isn't being tracked wouldn't it be a reliable car ? Also wouldn't any issues the car have be covered under warranty ?

Not disputing your message I would just think that a new subaru would be covered under warranty unless it an issue that occurred due to the owner tracking/racing it and when I say that I don't mean a quick race on the street.

[clyde]

:speechle:

Bwahauhumha?

I don't know much about this car but if you find one that isn't being tracked wouldn't it be a reliable car ? Also wouldn't any issues the car have be covered under warranty ?

Not disputing your message I would just think that a new subaru would be covered under warranty unless it an issue that occurred due to the owner tracking/racing it and when I say that I don't mean a quick race on the street.

The new one got a new trans under warranty. Probably not the 2011 one because probably out of warranty by then, but dunno the owner or what happened afterward.

My wife's 2013 Outback has been dead nuts reliable so far through 65k miles with minimal maintenance beyond frequent oil & filter changes (it burns oil so fast, the oil almost doesn't need to be changed). It's been wrecked hard a few times. We'll keep it until it's time to bury it.

Seeing how a number of WRXs have fared locally, I don't think I could buy one with plans to use it for just a few years. Admittedly, the ones I know are driven hard and sometimes put away wet, but they seem to fare rather poorly compared to most other cars used in a similar manner.

OTOH, I beat the crap out of a 2004 RX-8 for three years and only had two issues of note: A blown up coil pack very early on and a broken plastic sleeve on the steering column that allowed for some annoying vertical play in the wheel. Nothing critical. Lots of other owners I knew repeatedly blew up transmissions. Had all kinds of engine problems and other serious problems...and that was before we found out that few Renesis engines would last 75,000 miles without needing a rebuild. Most people that drove mine and others thought mine was a very strong example.

All that...there are good examples of bad cars and bad examples of good cars. It only matters how good the one in your driveway is.

[rumatt]

1099410995

[3LOU5]

Talked to them. They're saying they were worried about parts breaking off and possibly being in the cooling system.

And the "housing" is "what it connects to inside, to pump the water. It was scratched. Or something.

Fuck I don't know.

But I mentioned I might keep it a while and he said, "sure why not. It's the last good BMW and it's in great condition. Just keep putting engines in it. They'll just keep getting cheaper. For a while anyway." :lol"

I've replaced mine myself TWICE before they exploded like yours did. I've done a handful of water pumps in various domestics and imports, and my BMW was one of the easiest to work on.

No offense, but your mechanic sucks ass if he somehow damaged it during replacement.

[rumatt]

No offense, but your mechanic sucks ass if he somehow damaged it during replacement.
No, not that they caused damage. The concern was scratches and/or damage from the high-speed spinning thingy that broke, inside the other thingy.... that it might have released stuff into the other stuff, which could do bad stuff.

Or something.

:dunno:

I don't care. I'm just driving it. :bigpimp:

[3LOU5]

No, not that they caused damage. The concern was scratches and/or damage from the high-speed spinning thingy that broke, inside the other thingy.... that it might have released stuff into the other stuff, which could do bad stuff.

Or something.

:dunno:

I don't care. I'm just driving it. :bigpimp:

Oh, ok. I got ya.

There is a valid concern for the broken impeller blades from the old pump to clog the water passages in either the radiator or engine block.

Ah, just watch your temp gauge. If your engine overheats and you end up killing your BMW, it'll give you a good reason to buy a new(ish) car, lol.

:lol::lol::thumbup::thumbup:

[bren]

Oh my.

Is that an OE BMW pump, or did you do one of the aftermarket pumps at the last replacement?

[John V]

Recall that the water pump actually bolts onto the front cover on the non-M E46, not the block itself. Maybe that's what they meant.

I don't see how they could have scratched it - if the blades disintegrated, no big deal, unless someone at some point put in one of the aftermarket pumps with the metal blades. Those things are always a bad idea, unless it's the Stewart one, which seems to be (anecdotally) very long-lived.

[rumatt]

A dealership near me has two manual 2016 Audi S4's in sports diff. I might have to go drive one.

[JST]

That's the droid you are looking for. Get one while you still can.

[bren]

Don't forget to take your bike to make sure it fits. ;)

[kognito]

That's the droid you are looking for. Get one while you still can.

:+1

[John V]

Given how rapidly audis depreciate, I wouldn't buy a new one

[rumatt]

I drive this one today. I liked it and might make an offer.

It does have the sports diff, even though it's not listed. And it's in great shape, new tires, and is in my color.

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=10562&endYear=2017&modelCode1=S4&showcaseOwnerId=0&makeCode1=AUDI&startYear=1981&firstRecord=0&transmissionCode=MAN&transmissionCodes=MAN&searchRadius=50&showcaseListingId=0&mmt=%5BAUDI%5BS4%5B%5D%5D%5B%5D%5D&listingId=439867714&Log=0

[rumatt]

Don't forget to take your bike to make sure it fits. ;)
:lol:

[rumatt]

The gas mileage on the dash was 12.1 :lol:

[rumatt]

I just drove a 340i xdrive.

How f*cking bizarre is that steering. :(

[Josh (PA)]

I just drove a 340i xdrive.

How f*cking bizarre is that steering. :(

was it bad? That's a bummer I was really hoping they'd get their shit together.

that 2014 S4 looks pretty sweet

[bren]

I drive this one today. I liked it and might make an offer.

It does have the sports diff, even though it's not listed. And it's in great shape, new tires, and is in my color.

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=10562&endYear=2017&modelCode1=S4&showcaseOwnerId=0&makeCode1=AUDI&startYear=1981&firstRecord=0&transmissionCode=MAN&transmissionCodes=MAN&searchRadius=50&showcaseListingId=0&mmt=%5BAUDI%5BS4%5B%5D%5D%5B%5D%5D&listingId=439867714&Log=0
It looks baby blue on my phone. Perfect for you!

[rumatt]

was it bad? That's a bummer I was really hoping they'd get their shit together.

that 2014 S4 looks pretty sweet
It (the BMW steering) was strange. In comfort mode it had a very clear dead spot on center. Who would possibly want that, I have no idea.

Then in sport mode it was better. But it was still bizarre. On center was not too bad but then as you turn the wheel, the resistance when up really quickly. The wheel effort was very non-linear.

I have no idea if I'd get used to it or hate it if I drive it every day.

I liked the engine and seats in the BMW better than the S4. Something about it was more fun than the Audi

[Alan]

It (the BMW steering) was strange. In comfort mode it had a very clear dead spot on center. Who would possibly want that, I have no idea.

Then in sport mode it was better. But it was still bizarre. On center was not too bad but then as you turn the wheel, the resistance when up really quickly. The wheel effort was very non-linear.

I have no idea if I'd get used to it or hate it if I drive it every day.

I liked the engine and seats in the BMW better than the S4. Something about it was more fun than the Audi

I love the steering in the new 3 series especially compared to my 5er which still has the hydraulic steering but that might be because I am used to electric steering ...

Neither car has great road feel and being you are used to the E46 which has considerably more 'feel' you will find the electric steering feeling disconnected by comparison.

Here is an article that discusses this

http://www.caranddriver.com/features/electric-vs-hydraulic-steering-a-comprehensive-comparison-test-feature

[equ]

I don't mind the EPS on my f10 535i rwd. The article is somewhat reassuring, I didn't realize that certain f10's got hydraulics.

Interestingly, I had real issues with and over nearly two years never got comfortable with the steering on the b8 a4 or the b8.5 s4. I'd say the s4 was worse. It was firmer and better for a test drive and better for country roads. The highway was not fun in that car, the steering would be incredibly heavy at 80mph making the car feel like not wanting to turn (which was not the case). Also the revs were higher in the 3.0T s4 than the 2.0T a4, both in 6th gear. Between the revs, torque and steering, driving 75-85mph for long stretches was not relaxed in the s4. The 535i does it much better (albeit with a touch of lazy boy) and even the a4 was better.

If I were to get another s4, I'd look for a 2012. Last year of the hydraulic and early teething issues fixed.

[rumatt]

I love the steering in the new 3 series especially compared to my 5er which still has the hydraulic steering but that might be because I am used to electric steering

Interesting. What year and model? And what steering options? Do you have the VSS variable steering? I hear that makes thing better, and my car didn't have it.

[rumatt]

Drove a WRX. Next.

Audi S4 doesn't have song advance button on steering wheel. Next. :lol:

Found a 2017 manual transmission 330xi with all the fancy steering and suspension options. I'll give that one a try before I give up on BMW.

But right now, e46 + Cayman is winning.

[John V]

I will be shocked if you like any flavor of F30.

[bren]

Mecan?

[Josh (PA)]

:dunno:Jag XE can be had w/ a stick (and the 2.5 4cylinder):dunno:

[rumatt]

:dunno:Jag XE can be had w/ a stick (and the 2.5 4cylinder):dunno:
Yeah I should try it.

Edit:

"One thing we Americans will not get: a manual transmission option on any of the cars. They couldn’t make a business case for it, I was told. "

https://www.google.com/amp/jalopnik.com/the-2017-jaguar-xe-is-good-but-definitely-not-the-best-1782004733/amp?client=ms-android-verizon

[bren]

Have you looked the ats yet?

[rumatt]

Have you looked the ats yet?
No. I don't think I can go there.

I guess that makes me some kind of car bigot / snob?

Aka... carmudgeon?

[Sharp11]

Yeah I should try it.

Edit:

"One thing we Americans will not get: a manual transmission option on any of the cars. They couldn’t make a business case for it, I was told. "

https://www.google.com/amp/jalopnik.com/the-2017-jaguar-xe-is-good-but-definitely-not-the-best-1782004733/amp?client=ms-android-verizon

NPR did a piece the other day, 5% of cars sold today offer a stick, in 1987, that number was 25%.

Of course, the NPR piece didn't tell us how many varieties of cars are on the market today vs 1987 ... so it's hard to make a direct comparison.

Still it would seem, especially since better fuel mileage is no longer a calling card, fewer manuals will be offered in the years to come.

[bren]

No. I don't think I can go there.

I guess that makes me some kind of car bigot / snob?

Aka... carmudgeon?


Just go take a look, I'm curious to hear what you think.

Maybe you just need to embrace your inner Jersey.

edit:
just look at all of that bike space:

http://www.cars.com/crp/vp/images/13cadillac_ats/SAM_2787_fold.jpg

[Plaz]

My wife wants the new Audi A4 Allroad. At least it has a dual-clutch auto now instead of the horrid Audi slushbox.

[Jeff_DML]

My wife wants the new Audi A4 Allroad. At least it has a dual-clutch auto now instead of the horrid Audi slushbox.

note they ditched the traditional quattro on it and now have a haldex like setup, aka fwd until slip

[kognito]

note they ditched the traditional quattro on it and now have a haldex like setup, aka fwd until slip

Is that what is in the VW wagon awd as well?

[Jeff_DML]

Is that what is in the VW wagon awd as well?

VW wagon has actual haldex but the new audi quattro system looks similar

http://jalopnik.com/audis-high-tech-new-quattro-is-about-to-piss-off-its-bi-1760502139

[Plaz]

note they ditched the traditional quattro on it and now have a haldex like setup, aka fwd until slip

Yeah, she doesn't care. It'll just be an around town putterer and occasional family road trip car. Switching the AWD setup bought them a few MPGs I assume.

[wdc330i]

My wife wants the new Audi A4 Allroad. At least it has a dual-clutch auto now instead of the horrid Audi slushbox.

If Rumatt would do a slushy, you could sell him your thousand-year-old e46 wagon. :)

[Alan]

Just go take a look, I'm curious to hear what you think.

Maybe you just need to embrace your inner Jersey.

edit:
just look at all of that bike space:

http://www.cars.com/crp/vp/images/13cadillac_ats/SAM_2787_fold.jpg


That interior looks beuatiful .. wow I think I'll check out the caddys

[Sharp11]

That interior looks beuatiful .. wow I think I'll check out the caddys

How can you tell, it looks like every "premium" sedan made over the past 20 years ... :dunno:

[rumatt]

Drove the manual 340 xdrive. No dice. Hated the steering.

There was also a used 2016 M2 smg sitting near the show room door so I took that out too. I kind of liked it.

[John V]

Matt, my shop is empty right now...

[rumatt]

Matt, my shop is empty right now...
I'm getting closer to a decision :lol:

[rumatt]

Matt, my shop is empty right now...

I'm leaning toward buying an M2. I liked it quite a bit, and it's just big enough that I could (maybe?) live with it as my only car.

The other option is to fix up the E46 and later buy something fun like a Cayman. But I just can't get excited about maintaining 2 cars, and still not really having a vehicle that is a) practical or b) good in in winter

M2 might be my ticket.

EDIT: I'm even considering the CDT transmission :shock:

[equ]

I think the m2 will be a solid choice. It's right-sized (e46 dimensions to within an inch) and has less ouches driving it than the m3/m4.

If you are sticking with one car, I would not recommend a cayman or any other strict 2-seater.

[rumatt]

(e46 dimensions to within an inch)

Interestingly I measured the distance from the back of the front seats to the trunk opening. It was 64 inches. In my e46 it's 70 (or more, depending where exactly I measure to. I'm sure quite sure how that's possible given the outside dimensions.


Unrelated to that, here's a cool comparison of the M2 vs Cayman GTS

https://youtu.be/HmKJERUYJXQ

[bren]

I'm sure the m2 is a great car - if you can deal with the steering.

Can you get one without crazy mark-up?

[rumatt]

I'm sure the m2 is a great car - if you can deal with the steering.

Can you get one without crazy mark-up?

Not sure. I'm going to ask around and see. I won't pay over MSRP.

The M2's steering felt fantastic when driving it immediately after the 340. Maybe that's BMW's strategy all along -- push people toward the M2 :lol:

[wdc330i]

Not sure. I'm going to ask around and see. I won't pay over MSRP.

The M2's steering felt fantastic when driving it immediately after the 340. Maybe that's BMW's strategy all along -- push people toward the M2 :lol:

Maybe xi vs rwd?

[rumatt]

Maybe xi vs rwd?
Maybe, but I wouldn't bet on it. It's not a mechanical issue, it's their programming. It's loose on center then stiffens up as you turn it. IMO it feels like someone is messing with you by tugging on the wheel or something.

The salesman in the car with me was pretty honest about his dislike of the 3-series steering as well. He claimed the steering quality order is:

1) M2
2) Non-M 2-series, saying it's closer to the M2 than the 3-series
3) 3-series

Overall the 3-series just isn't very sporty or fun. It's large (compared to what I'm used to) and isolated. Not that these things are bad if it's what you're looking for.

[Jeff_DML]

Steering was disappointing in the m2/3/4's I drove recently. Seems to be a common issue with modern cars so I guess whatever.

Get the m2:)

[Jeff_DML]

This Matt seems to be enjoying it

-yOtQJbYFUk

[Sharp11]

Maybe, but I wouldn't bet on it. It's not a mechanical issue, it's their programming. It's loose on center then stiffens up as you turn it. IMO it feels like someone is messing with you by tugging on the wheel or something.

The salesman in the car with me was pretty honest about his dislike of the 3-series steering as well. He claimed the steering quality order is:

1) M2
2) Non-M 2-series, saying it's closer to the M2 than the 3-series
3) 3-series

Overall the 3-series just isn't very sporty or fun. It's large (compared to what I'm used to) and isolated. Not that these things are bad if it's what you're looking for.

You might try one of the more pedestrian 2 series - I've not driven one, but many people seem to prefer them for daily use over the M models.

[rumatt]

You might try one of the more pedestrian 2 series - I've not driven one, but many people seem to prefer them for daily use over the M models.
Yeah, was thinking about it.

What's bizarre is that the 240 is actually about as fast straight line, and if you spec them equally, costs more.

It also has the newer B58 engine that could eventually make its way into the M2

[bren]

You might try one of the more pedestrian 2 series - I've not driven one, but many people seem to prefer them for daily use over the M models.

No diff., no sale. :D

[Josh (PA)]

I think you can get the 240 in x-drive if winter traction is important.

Although the M2 w/ lsd and snows would probably work almost as well.

[rumatt]

I think you can get the 240 in x-drive if winter traction is important.
Not with a manual!

No diff., no sale. :D
Agrees. Although I think there's a dealer installed diff for like 3k. Making it even more expensive than the M2.

[equ]

I have trouble enjoying bottled up high power cars and that rarely get to run through the rev range under power.

The boxster S (at rated 315, might higher in reality) is more than enough power for me, perhaps too much. And it has been way more fun than the GT4 with greater compliance, and the slightly less but still sufficient torque making it a joy.

The S4 felt like 'too much' around where I live, just a nervous car, especially on the highway, decent around country roads. Spectacular on snow.

The e46 M3 has about the 'right' pull for me. It could use a better suspension, but I'm not sure I'm willing to sink that kind of dough.

The 535i is slightly on the portly side for 300hp but it seems to be tuned a bit more for low end torque. But the power is different in that car, compared to the small, tight, hard cars I'm used to, this car is a Rolls. The power is 'enough', it doesn't need to be rated, and it wafts on the highway. Sure it could have more power, but then it would need more suspension and brakes that would not make it any smoother.

I didn't think the v8 m3 was 'too much' but that car was revvy. I don't think I'd like a 400hp car with tons of torque for the street, did not love, love the GT4 e.g. I doubt I'd like the m2 as a daily.

In summary, whether for 3100 (boxster), 3450? (m3) or 4100 lbs (535i), in the low 300's is where it's at for me regarding power. Also all three are rwd, 6-speed manual and 6-cylinder.

[rumatt]

I doubt I'd like the m2 as a daily.
I think I could like it a lot of the time, maybe even most of the time. But I've come to the realization that I'd probably still want to keep my E46 as a beater or long highway trips.

So I'd have an E46 and M2, neither of which is great in winter nor particularly practical. And that's fairly retarded.

Meh, I might do it anyway. Or not.

I hate cars.

[Jeff_DML]

Equ,

I am confused, why would you not want a ton of torque for the street? seems like the lazy easy way to drive instead of having to wind it out. But I would not consider the GT4 as having a ton of torque.


>>>>>

M2 seems a lot easier daily driver of a e46 since a modern car, non adjustable suspension but I do not foresee if being that rough of a ride.

[Plaz]

I love my 1M as a daily. I assume the m2 would be very similar. Get some slightly smaller wheels for winter tires and more sidewall for potholed winter streets and you're golden. It's firm, but only objectionable to asses conditioned to Buick/Toyota levels of mushy couch-osity.

[FC]

I hate cars.

:lol:

[bren]

I think I could like it a lot of the time, maybe even most of the time. But I've come to the realization that I'd probably still want to keep my E46 as a beater or long highway trips.

So I'd have an E46 and M2, neither of which is great in winter nor particularly practical. And that's fairly retarded.

Meh, I might do it anyway. Or not.

I hate cars.
Why wouldn't you take the newer car on highway trips. :?

M2 seems like a perfectly good daily driver (from the guy who's been DD'ing an e46m3 forever.)

[rumatt]

Why wouldn't you take the newer car on highway trips. :?


I don't know.. Maybe I would?

But between the noise, mileage, small gas tank, putting boring miles on the car. :dunno:

[wdc330i]

I don't know.. Maybe I would?

But between the noise, mileage, small gas tank, putting boring miles on the car. :dunno:

I'd take the car least likely to leave me stranded on the side of the road.;)

[equ]

Why wouldn't you take the newer car on highway trips. :?

M2 seems like a perfectly good daily driver (from the guy who's been DD'ing an e46m3 forever.)

+1. As much I don't see myself daily driving an M2, no way would I daily an old car. Once you have them side by side, you'll see no reason at all to keep the e46.

[rumatt]

I'd take the car least likely to leave me stranded on the side of the road.;)

:lol:

+1. As much I don't see myself daily driving an M2, no way would I daily an old car. Once you have them side by side, you'll see no reason at all to keep the e46.

You guys may be right.

[wdc330i]

Do you have a coupe now? That would be my only hiccup with the M2.

[rumatt]

Do you have a coupe now? That would be my only hiccup with the M2.

My E46 is a sedan. The coupe angle is part of my hesitation of having it as my only car.

I might just buy one, let the e46 sit and see what happens.

[wdc330i]

My E46 is a sedan. The coupe angle is part of my hesitation of having it as my only car.

I might just buy one, let the e46 sit and see what happens.

My choice would be to buy the M2. Sell the e46, and then add some Subaru thingy or whatever down the road if you need a beater.

Definitely get some winter wheels and tires for the M2, or you will need the beater sooner rather than later.

[rumatt]

My choice would be to buy the M2. Sell the e46, and then add some Subaru thingy or whatever down the road if you need a beater

Ironically enough I was just looking at Outback prices on autotrader. :D

[wdc330i]

Ironically enough I was just looking at Outback prices on autotrader. :D

:D

[kognito]

without a motor? :D

http://www.coltonrv.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/T18276-2016-Keystone-OUTBACK-210TRS-Travel-Trailer-11-560x371.jpg

[rumatt]

I've considered just about everything else thus far so sure, why not.

Oddly enough... The houses I've owned I've bought on first sight. No indecision.

Cars, not so much. Fun fact: in the last 14 years I've bought twice as many houses as I have cars. (!)

[John V]

Ironically enough I was just looking at Outback prices on autotrader. :D

:ack:

[rumatt]

:ack:

Don't worry, my search didn't last long. :bustingup


I have two dealers offering me an M2 at MSRP and claim it would arrive arrive in 8-12 weeks. But I can't seem to pull the trigger.

In other news, have you guys heard the rumors that the 2-series may switch to FWD soon? :eek::shock:

[Theo]

Wait there's not a mark up on the M2 anymore???? I need to go talk to my dealer.

[rumatt]

I think it's just disappearing now at some dealers

[bren]

Do you really want your new m2 to show up in Jan/Feb? Maybe the dealer won't mind throwing the winter wheels on so you can get it home. :D

[rumatt]

Do you really want your new m2 to show up in Jan/Feb? Maybe the dealer won't mind throwing the winter wheels on so you can get it home. :D

Yeah not ideal, but also not horrible. It seems a tirerack winter wheel & tire package can be purchased for about $1500

[zach]

Yeah not ideal, but also not horrible. It seems a tirerack winter wheel & tire package can be purchased for about $1500

I have some old e46 wheels I'll sell you.

[rumatt]

I have some old e46 wheels I'll sell you.

:lol: :lol:

[Theo]

Do you really want your new m2 to show up in Jan/Feb? Maybe the dealer won't mind throwing the winter wheels on so you can get it home. :D

Rain never hurt a car. 😜

[rumatt]

Rain never hurt a car. 😜

http://i.huffpost.com/gadgets/slideshows/307424/slide_307424_2673273_free.jpg?w=500

:p

[JST]

:lol: :lol:

I have a set of snow tires/wheels from my E90 M3 that I need to get rid of.

[bren]

I have a set of snow tires/wheels from my E90 M3 that I need to get rid of.

Will they fit an e46?

[JST]

Will they fit an e46?

Not sure. Maybe? I have to go home and see what the offsets are.

[Theo]

http://i.huffpost.com/gadgets/slideshows/307424/slide_307424_2673273_free.jpg?w=500

:p

HA!! Point taken

[JST]

German
Turbocharged engine
Plenty of room for your bike
$26K
http://www.mbvans.com/sprinter/commercial-vans/metris-worker-cargo-van

[rumatt]

Too bad it's an automatic.

[clyde]

I have some old e46 wheels I'll sell you.

Soon, Matt will have some old e46 to sell you.

[bren]

Soon, Matt will have some old e46 to sell me for a DSP build.

Fixed that for you. :D

[rumatt]

Fixed that for you. :D

Part of me feels like that needs to happen. Thank the car for its service and pass it off to Team WTF. :bigpimp:

But I'm still undecided. I'm driving a 981 Cayman tomorrow.

[clyde]

Fixed that for you. :D

Part of me feels like that needs to happen. Thank the car for its service and pass it off to Team WTF. :bigpimp:

I know what bren's running next year!

I mean, I don't, but still.

[John V]

Fixed that for you. :D

You misspelled "RX-8" in that post

[JST]

Will they fit an e46?



Wheels are 18x8 et 20 for the fronts
18x9 et 20 for the rears

Fronts prob wouldn't fit an e46; I remember having to use a 10 mm spacer to get the E46 wheels to fit on my E90.

[rumatt]

So today I got stuck in my driveway because it had wet leaves covering it. I tried 3 times before giving up and getting the leaf blower out. :lol:

[bren]

Wheels are 18x8 et 20 for the fronts
18x9 et 20 for the rears

Fronts prob wouldn't fit an e46; I remember having to use a 10 mm spacer to get the E46 wheels to fit on my E90.

Yeah, the wheels I use up front now are 17x8 et40.

[Alan]

So today I got stuck in my driveway because it had wet leaves covering it. I tried 3 times before giving up and getting the leaf blower out. :lol:

Next time go up the driveway in reverse

[rumatt]

Next time go up the driveway in reverse

How's that going to help?

[rumatt]

When discussing AWD vehicles available with a stick.......... how'd we miss this?

https://www.audiusa.com/newsroom/news/press-releases/2016/09/2017-audi-a4-six-speed-manual-transmission

[rumatt]

So today I drove several cars:

2014 (981) Cayman S: It was nice? I guess? I'm coming to the conclusion that I'm just not a porsche guy. I had a bigger smile on my face getting out of the M2. Maybe it's a thing for guys named Matt (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfHSuv12UIs), because I tend to agree with him. Particularly regarding the torque curve. And is a clutch that heavy somehow better why? I'm still not ruling them out, but I need to take care of figuring out a DD first.

2016 BMW M240i Xdrive: I didn't enjoy this nearly as much as the M2. The steering felt funny to me again (although not as bad as the 3-series) and it just felt like a small coupe. Why would I want a just-a-small-coupe? If I'm going to put up with the downsides of a small, 2-door car it had better be kick-ass.

2016 Subaru Impreza: No way. And not because it's an econobox with a gutless 2.0 engine. The seats were *awful*. Not only was there no back support, but there were no side bolsters so I was sliding all over the place.

2014 Audi A4 with Premium Plus and Sports package: I actually kind of liked it. Yeah it's boring... and has long throws, and has turbot lag. But maybe I'm just old and boring? I kept thinking.. "at under 30K I could get this and have budget left for something fun to go with it"

2013 Audi S4: This was my second time driving one and while it was nice, I just couldn't get excited about it. The sound is all engine noise, no exhaust. And while it's more responsive than the A4, it's at the cost of awful gas mileage 10-15k purchase price. And somehow trying to make a car that big and heavy "sporty" just feels out of character.

2016 Mazda Miata: I tried one again and it turns out I do indeed fit in them. But I didn't enjoy it as much as I had hoped. Yeah the pedals and gearbox is nice, but it's loud and kind of cramped. And the engine noise didn't get me excited. It was more like, um... damn this thing is noisy and I can feel every pebble in the road and this rear view mirror is blocking almost my entire right half of the windshield and my left elbow is kind of pressing up against the door. I can't see myself picking this car very often on my drive to work.

Conclusion: I want to dump my 330 and buy an Audi A4 and a BMW M2. Too bad that's about double my budget. :irate:

So I'm thinking of just buying a manual 2017 Audi A4 when they're available and seeing what happens after that. Or buying the 2014 I mentioned above.. but I think I want all the cool phone connectivity stuff in the newer ones.

Side note: Valenti Auto Center in CT is pretty awesome. They currently have 3 manual A4's and 4 manual S4's in on the lot. That's more than the entire 50 mile radius surrounding me combined. The guy said they buy just about every one they can.

[JST]

When discussing AWD vehicles available with a stick.......... how'd we miss this?

https://www.audiusa.com/newsroom/news/press-releases/2016/09/2017-audi-a4-six-speed-manual-transmission

That was just announced relatively recently. It does sound like a pretty compelling option. Or, more accurately, one of the only options.

[wdc330i]

That was just announced relatively recently. It does sound like a pretty compelling option. Or, more accurately, one of the only options.

As a single car solution, and given where you live, it makes a lot of sense.

[Alan]

How's that going to help?

Try it I think it will get you up the driveway. It's like fwd but in reverse : pint:

[bren]

I thought the Audi was out because it was missing a steering wheel button? :speechle:

[equ]

A4 is a good car, but I think you may get bored over time.

[rumatt]

I thought the Audi was out because it was missing a steering wheel button? :speechle:
What can I say, I'm flexible. :lol:

[rumatt]

A4 is a good car, but I think you may get bored over time.
Yeah, definitely a concern if it's my only vehicle.

[Josh (PA)]

what's wrong with the M2 and swapping the current rwd e46 for an e46xi or an older Asomething quattro as a winter beater?

[rumatt]

what's wrong with the M2 and swapping the current rwd e46 for an e46xi or an older Asomething quattro as a winter beater?
If I could find one that I trusted that could be fine. But something super old, like an e46, is probably going to need work done to make it reliable. Plus wasn't the e46 awd pretty worthless?

But a manual e90 with xdrive & sport seats isn't the worst idea I've ever heard. If anyone knows of any....

[equ]

Then take an a4 (something in the 25k range could be had with cpo) and that leaves room in the kitty for a sports car. Not many folks like having two cars (I do - and then some).

[kognito]

yeah, I've owned a few Audi's, but I am not brave enough to buy one out of any warranty

[Josh (PA)]

If I could find one that I trusted that could be fine. But something super old, like an e46, is probably going to need work done to make it reliable. Plus wasn't the e46 awd pretty worthless?

But a manual e90 with xdrive & sport seats isn't the worst idea I've ever heard. If anyone knows of any....

e90xi rides like shit.

All e46s need some work, but most of it is discretionary... you should know.

I'd find an above average e46xi, buy a set of 17" wheels with Nokian Hakka snow tires and leave them on all year. My little wagon w/ Hakkas was incredible last year in the blizzard. Good snow tires make all the difference.

[Nick M3]

If I could find one that I trusted that could be fine. But something super old, like an e46, is probably going to need work done to make it reliable. Plus wasn't the e46 awd pretty worthless?

But a manual e90 with xdrive & sport seats isn't the worst idea I've ever heard. If anyone knows of any....
E46 AWD was fine for non-performance use.

Edit: In truth, it would have been a real hoot if i could have had ABS and the E-diff disabled. I pulled the ABS fuse one time, and the car was an absolute hoot. But the brakes are not set up to function without ABS, so it was lockup city.

[John V]

E46 brake bias without ABS is terrifying.

I don't agree about the E90xi ride. My brother has one (sedan, 328, manual transmission, sport seats) and it's actually a great car. I don't have any issue with the ride. The big downside for me is the steering is pretty heavy and woolen. It's still better than a RWD F30, but it's got a really odd feel.

John

[rumatt]

The other option is to buy newish Audi as my boring car and have JV turn my e46 into a hot rod. John do you do superchargers? :speechle:

[John V]

The other option is to buy newish Audi as my boring car and have JV turn my e46 into a hot rod. John do you do superchargers? :speechle:

Sure, why not? I was thinking of putting one on mine at some point.

[rumatt]

Here's a clone of mine, but it has a front bumper, smaller engine and AWD.

(And a ghetto radio)

https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/l-Used-BMW-3-Series-Lakewood-d1512_L22191?page=15#listing=104140358

[Jeff_DML]

My wife wants the new Audi A4 Allroad. At least it has a dual-clutch auto now instead of the horrid Audi slushbox.

Looks pretty good, too bad pretty spendy.

http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-global/dims3/GLOB/legacy_thumbnail/750x422/quality/95/https://s.blogcdn.com/slideshows/images/slides/424/350/1/S4243501/slug/l/11-2017-audi-a4-allroad-fd-1.jpg

http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-global/dims3/GLOB/legacy_thumbnail/750x422/quality/95/https://s.blogcdn.com/slideshows/images/slides/424/350/4/S4243504/slug/l/14-2017-audi-a4-allroad-fd-1.jpg

note they ditched the traditional quattro on it and now have a haldex like setup, aka fwd until slip

The new quattro system sounds reasonable for a non-performance awd. Nice that is has the offroad setting too,


http://www.autoblog.com/2016/10/24/2017-audi-a4-allroad-first-drive-review/

[rumatt]

Wheels are 18x8 et 20 for the fronts
18x9 et 20 for the rears.

The M2 is et 29 front, 40 rear. Bah

[rumatt]

I'd find an above average e46xi, buy a set of 17" wheels with Nokian Hakka snow tires and leave them on all year.

That's not a bad idea at all. But I think it needs to be a wagon. If I'm going to have 2 cars, at least one of them should be practical.

Bren: Find me a 325xi wagon with sports package and heated seats, and at a non-retarded price.... and I'll sell you my car.

Unfortunately they don't seem to exist. I'm finding a decent number of X3's in manual. Maybe I should at least drive one. :nono: this one (http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=10512&endYear=2017&referrer=%2Fcars-for-sale%2Fsearchresults.xhtml%3Fzip%3D10512%26endYear %3D2017%26modelCode1%3DX3%26showcaseOwnerId%3D0%26 makeCode1%3DBMW%26startYear%3D1981%26firstRecord%3 D0%26searchRadius%3D10%26modelCodeList%3DX3%26make CodeList%3DBMW%26mmt%3D%255BBMW%255BX3%255B%255D%2 55D%255B%255D%255D&modelCode1=X3&showcaseOwnerId=0&makeCode1=BMW&startYear=1981&firstRecord=0&numRecords=25&searchRadius=10&listingId=431657472&makeCode1=BMW&modelCode1=X3) is just a couple miles from my house.

I'd also consider a subaru if they made one with a seat that didn't make me want to squirm out of the car immediately because it was so awful. That thing was miserable.




.

[bren]

I think Clyde should buy the car, JV can build it, and I'll tow it around. :D

Close enough:
https://www.bmwcca.org/ads/124411

Edit:
You want an 07 or newer x3.

[rumatt]

I think Clyde should buy the car, JV can build it, and I'll tow it around. :D
All the same to me :D

Close enough:
https://www.bmwcca.org/ads/124411

Sport seats are pretty important. And that's reallly far away. But I mailed him.
You want an 06 or newer x3.
Why's that?

[bren]

All the same to me :D

Sport seats are pretty important. And that's reallly far away. But I mailed him.

Why's that?

Revised AWD system, and more power.

[rumatt]

Revised AWD system, and more power.
Ah, I think that's 2007. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_X3#2006.E2.80.932010

[equ]

I wanted to want a 2006-7-ish x3 manual. For me, personally, it didn't take more than 5 minutes of driving to rule it out.

[rumatt]

I wanted to want a 2006-7-ish x3 manual. For me, personally, it didn't take more than 5 minutes of driving to rule it out.

I drove an 2004 (2005?) X3 back when they were new. I didn't like it. I was hoping it would be different this time. :speechle:

So what are my options for cheap-ish, non-econobox awd vechicles with a hatch, and comfortable seats? Is a 2002-2005 BMW 325xiT my only option on the whole planet? :lol:

Should I consider a mini? :ack: I'm going to drive a 2007 WRX hatch tomorrow. I don't see why I'd want small, noisy turbo cars... but sure why not.

[equ]

Is manual a requirement? Without a hatch, a4 is closest. Or drop the econo/seat and go subaru. Nothing else. The x-bmw's are kind of weak sauce on snow. They are ok with snow tires, but only slightly better than rwd. Depends the level of snow you need to get through.

[rumatt]

Is manual a requirement? Without a hatch, a4 is closest. Or drop the econo/seat and go subaru.

Right. I'm starting to think I have to give up either wagon, or manual. Or hold out for that unicorn e46 325xiT.

I simply cannot deal with the seats in the subaru. Maybe the WRX seats are sportier, so I'll try.

I'm very close to ordering the the M2, using my current 1-wheel drive E46 to get through the winter, and then I'll have a year to find a comfort / winter vehicle

[equ]

Sounds like a plan. You really liked the M2.

[bren]

Ah, I think that's 2007. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_X3#2006.E2.80.932010

Yeah I edited my edit while you must've been wiki'ing.

If all you want is an occasional use winter/bike beater, get a truck and put a cap on it.

[Josh (PA)]

how much / how hard is it to swap a manual into an auto 325xit. You can find decent auto wagons relatively easily and I'm sure you can grab a maunal transmission from a junkyard sedan cheaply. Just need to know how much JV will charge to finish the swap.

[John V]

I think you should try to find an E90 328xi.

[bren]

I think you should try to find an E90 328xi.

Done.

https://www.bmwcca.org/ads/123601

[John V]

I fail to see how this is not a perfect solution for Matt.

Rather than dump a bunch of money in the E46, sell it to someone who'll turn it into a race car, buy this E90 as a winter beater / bike hauler and pick up an M2 when the weather gets nice.

what is it that the kids do? Oh yeah:

/thread

[kognito]

Done.

https://www.bmwcca.org/ads/123601

yeah, buy this before I do


waffling over

[rumatt]

Done.

https://www.bmwcca.org/ads/123601
Holy shit that's perfect. I'd been searching for them everywhere except bmwcca

I hate white, and e90 wagons look like ugly turds, but I'll cave on that before the other requirements.

Doesn't say how many miles. I'll contact him.

[bren]

Holy shit that's perfect. I'd been searching for them everywhere except bmwcca

I hate white, and e90 wagons look like ugly turds, but I'll cave on that before the other requirements.

Doesn't say how many miles. I'll contact him.

Mileage
142000

I think I prefer the e90 to the e46 wagon. :dunno:

[wdc330i]

e90 wagons look like ugly turds.

Say what?

[Josh (PA)]

jump on that quick. manual wagons do not last

[rumatt]

Say what?

Beautiful color!

[wdc330i]

Beautiful color!

Good save :lol:

[rumatt]

Good save :lol:
:D

If actually looks pretty great in that photo.

I'll trade you a white one for it?

[John V]

I agree that the early e90 front end is awful.

You should get over it.

[rumatt]

Talked to him. He's a weird old dude who owns 7 BMW's. He's owned it since about 100k miles and has done brakes, suspension and some other things. But not the cooling system, so I may be calling JV's auto repair center at some point.

I'm gonna try to buy it.

[wdc330i]

Talked to him. He's a weird old dude who owns 7 BMW's. He's owned it since about 100k miles and has done brakes, suspension and some other things. But not the cooling system, so I may be calling JV's auto repair center at some point.

I'm gonna try to buy it.

Good call. The manual E91s sell at premium: http://enthusiastauto.com/qsearch/?id=5459&form_display=51

The only thing that would give me pause is that was the first model year, I think. But at that price, how could you complain?

[bren]

Ok, who else needs a car? I need to satisfy my own restlessness through others. :)

zach, got a great one for you too:
https://www.bmwcca.org/ads/123556

[John V]

Talked to him. He's a weird old dude who owns 7 BMW's. He's owned it since about 100k miles and has done brakes, suspension and some other things. But not the cooling system, so I may be calling JV's auto repair center at some point.

I'm gonna try to buy it.

Bet on the valve cover gasket starting to weep at that mileage as well. I bet he hasn't noticed it yet, but if you go drive it, get it hot and open the hood to sniff around for oil burning smells. It's not a hard job but it's labor intensive.

The E90 tends to eat HVAC fans as well. Easy job, not too expensive.

[wdc330i]

https://www.carmax.com/cars/bmw/328/2007/13646086

[rumatt]

https://www.carmax.com/cars/bmw/328/2007/13646086

Ohhh, better color. Those are the non-sport seats thought. Hmmm

[wdc330i]

Ohhh, better color. Those are the non-sport seats thought. Hmmm

Yes. I have the sport seats and they're really great. Not sure I would buy a car without them...

[rumatt]

The only thing that would give me pause is that was the first model year, I think. But at that price, how could you complain?

I was ready to offer asking price, but while talking with him on the phone I said "how negotiable is the price?" He replied, "Sure it's negotiable. Everything is negiotiable". So I emailed him offering $7400.

He replied saying, "No" and was annoyed I made such a low offer "before even seeing the car's condition and all its records". :lol: :ack:

So I offered $8400 and he hasn't replied. I may just drive the 2+ hours with a pile of cash and a friend (to drive my car home) and haggle on the spot. I'm going to end up paying over asking :lol: if he talks to me at all now. :banghead: unfortunately I can't go until Saturday.

[wdc330i]

:lol: Sounds like your seller knows how to play the game. ;)

[rumatt]

Exactly. :)

Now he's saying he has multiple people coming this weekend so he can't sell yet for under asking. I offered asking a said I could pick it up Friday.

[Jeff_DML]

I was ready to offer asking price, but while talking with him on the phone I said "how negotiable is the price?" He replied, "Sure it's negotiable. Everything is negiotiable". So I emailed him offering $7400.

He replied saying, "No" and was annoyed I made such a low offer "before even seeing the car's condition and all its records". :lol: :ack:

So I offered $8400 and he hasn't replied. I may just drive the 2+ hours with a pile of cash and a friend (to drive my car home) and haggle on the spot. I'm going to end up paying over asking :lol: if he talks to me at all now. :banghead: unfortunately I can't go until Saturday.

he should try craiglists if he wants to see lowball offers:D

[rumatt]

he should try craiglists if he wants to see lowball offers:D
I'll give you $500 CASH MONEY TODAY!

[wdc330i]

I'll give you $500 CASH MONEY TODAY!

Ugh. Just went through all that crap with the old X5. PTSD.

[blee]

"Hi, I'm a jobless vagabond with no income or savings, but I'd like to have a car. Would you please accept a monthly payment of $50 until it's paid off?" --More or less what I got every other day when I was selling my old 525i.

[rumatt]

Going tomorrow night to pay and pickup the car.

[wdc330i]

Crossing fingers for you. Obviously old high mileage cars don't scare you much ;)

[bren]

Going tomorrow night to pay and pickup the car.

WTG. Excellent tactics. :lol:

[rumatt]

WTG. Excellent tactics. :lol:
I'm a master negotiator! :lol:

I didn't leave a deposit so if I hate it when I arrive I don't have to buy it.
Crossing fingers for you. Obviously old high mileage cars don't scare you much ;)
I'm banking on making it through the winter and then begging JV to give it a good look over in the spring.

[rumatt]

Oh man, guy just called me because he wanted to talk more about the car. We were on the phone 40 minutes with him telling me stories about all his BMWs.

He's a life-long BMW fan. It was kind of cool actually. I want to invite him to join carmudgeons. :lol:

[wdc330i]

Oh man, guy just called me because he wanted to talk more about the car. We were on the phone 40 minutes with him telling me stories about all his BMWs.

He's a life-long BMW fan. It was kind of cool actually. I want to invite him to join carmudgeons. :lol:

Our new best friend. :lol:

[Jeff_DML]

...

He's a life-long BMW fan....

Doesn't sound like a carmudgeon to me:D

[rumatt]

Doesn't sound like a carmudgeon to me:D
:bustingup

[rumatt]

Here's the list of work he had done in the records he sent me (ignoring oil changes and brakes).

Damn that's kind of a lot. I hope that's a good thing. :speechle:


141,000 miles
- Transmission and diff fluids
- Clutch master cylinder (pressure hose, lock valve, pipe, clutch slave)

129,000
- Replace radio amplifier
- Xenon headlight bulbs

125,000
- AC hoses, condensor, evaporator
- AC refrigerant
- Front right hub and wheel bearing
- Front and rear shocks, bump stops and shock mounts
- Starter motor

121,000
- Radiator hoses: "Hose, expansion tank; Hose, Radiator, lower; Hose Radiator Upper"
- Antifreeze
- Cabin air filter
- Brake bleed



Unknown miles (8/10/2015)
- Power steering pump (pressure hose, pump, rack, pentosin mineral oil)

Unknown miles (11/24/2014)
- Front control arms: Lower control arm, both sides
- Tie Rod: both sides

109,000
- Steering column inermediate shaft: replace lower shaft

Unknown miles: 9/26/2014
- Halo Light housing
- Ignition coil (replace one)

Unknown miles: 12/27/2013
- "BMW Front Shaft" ($400) ??????

115,012
- O2 sensor
- Sprk plugs
- Battery