Hm...I've been wrong all along

[The HACK]

I thought E46 M3 suspension parts are not interchangeable with regular E46es. In talking with my mechanic today (very experience BMW mechanic, by the way...and another avid track junkie), he said that basically the shock, struts, and springs will fit. What is different on the M3s are the lower control arms for the front, and the control arms in the rear, as well as all the bushings. However, the mounting geometry is the same, and you CAN swap out the control arms front and back to M3 parts.

What is in-compatible, is the brake parts. The wheel hub, tie rod, and brake caliper mounting points are all different, thus the brake parts are not interchangeable.

I'm having him put in a new set of E46 M3 lower control arms up front and a set of powerflex urethane bushings all around. Will post review later in the week when the work is done.

[Mathew]

Ok, which E46 M3 owner wants to trade parts with me?

[The HACK]

Ok, which E46 M3 owner wants to trade parts with me?

Actually, how many miles do you have on your car?

Because if your E46 is long in the tooth, you may be way overdue for bushing upgrades. My steering has gotten sloppy over the past 3-4 months since the last track season and I think it's due to bushing degradation. Since I'd have to remove the LCA to get to the bushing anyway I figure I might as well replace the control arm. $253 each...Not too bad, considering the regular E46 sports control arms are $120 each.

[The HACK]

Oy. $1,500 for the whole bill. At least all the bushings are being replaced by the more reliable urethane bushings so for the life of the vehicle I wouldn't have to worry about it again. $500 alone for the control arms (M3 control arms are $250 each!), another $700 for the bushings (GC Hybrid front M3 bushings $399, PowerFlex rear trailing toe bushings $99, M3 bushing carrier $100 each).

Should be a worthy investment though.

[Nick M3]

So, have you driven it yet?

[The HACK]

So, have you driven it yet?

Work hasn't even started. Will drop car off at the shop this weekend, Imad (my mechanic) just ordered the parts today. We were trying to sort out the various issues with using M3 front LCA. The M3 front LCA has a much beefier mounting point into the rear bushing, so we can't just get Powerflex bushings and slap it into my existing bushing bracket. I'd have to get new hybrid (solid bearing encased in urethane bushing)M3 style bushings from Ground Control AND get M3 bushing brackets to accomodate it. That added about $200 to the cost on the brackets along. So my choice was either get the Mtech II LCAs from the ZHP, and re-use my bushing carrier for $1,100, or get the M3 setup for $1,500.

Trust me, y'all will be the second one to know once I have it installed and driven (the first ones will of course be my tribe buddies).

[clyde]

Trust me, y'all will be the second one to know once I have it installed and driven (the first ones will of course be my tribe buddies).

Is that going to make you the third? :?

[The HACK]

Trust me, y'all will be the second one to know once I have it installed and driven (the first ones will of course be my tribe buddies).

Is that going to make you the third? :?

Oh, wait. You guys will be the FOURTH to know. First will be Imad, my mechanic. Second would of course be me, third the SCTS Tribe members, and you guys next.

[clyde]

Trust me, y'all will be the second one to know once I have it installed and driven (the first ones will of course be my tribe buddies).

Is that going to make you the third? :?

Oh, wait. You guys will be the FOURTH to know. First will be Imad, my mechanic. Second would of course be me, third the SCTS Tribe members, and you guys next.And you're sure that Imad hasn't hired a certain former employee of Savage, right? I'd hate to be the fifth to know. ;)

[The HACK]

So it WAS too good to be true. Imad said that the M3 control arm has a much thicker bolt on the ball joint and can not be bolted onto the E46 without changing the steering knuckle as well. Bummer.

So I am reverting back to the original plan of using ZHP control arms and composite urethane bushings on M3 bushing mounts for the front, and urethane bushings for the rear.

And guess I wasn't gentle enough on the transmission, or that my "spin" at Buttwillow have caused more damage than I thought. My transmission seal is torn and it's slowly leaking transmission fluid, my guibo is again cracked and my diff-mount is cracked as well.

THANK GOD Imad is close by and is a good friend of SCTS tribe. The torn transmission seal, guibo, and diff mount would've taken $$$ to fix.

[The HACK]

Got my car back. :D

My commute sucks. Straight road, right turn onto ramp, straight freeway for 30 minutes, redlight at straight off-ramp, straight to work. No fun turns.

I was pleasantly surprised making a right turn at speeds that would usually leave me a little nervous though. If and when I can take the Huntington exit off of 210 W without significant traffic I'll let y'all know if the $$$ is well spent.

[Masskrug]

Summary of what you actually did?

[The HACK]

Summary of what you actually did?

:dunno:

What, too lazy to read through the entire thread? :roll:

Motorsports II front lower control arms, powerflex control arm urethane bushings, powerflex rear trailing arm bushings. Other maintenance work included replace both diff. carrier bushings, front transmission seal, and driveshaft coupler (guibo).

[Mathew]

Actually, how many miles do you have on your car?


42K

It's slowly becoming a garage queen though.

[Masskrug]

Summary of what you actually did?

:dunno:

What, too lazy to read through the entire thread? :roll:

Motorsports II front lower control arms, powerflex control arm urethane bushings, powerflex rear trailing arm bushings. Other maintenance work included replace both diff. carrier bushings, front transmission seal, and driveshaft coupler (guibo).

Not being as technically minded as you, I got somewhat confused by your dialogue about going back and forth between different spec parts...

[The HACK]

So after a couple of weeks, I can honestly tell you that this is a worthy upgrade IF and only if you are suffering from bushing problems up front, and you're out of warranty, and if you intend to track the vehicle.

OMFG! Before this upgrade (ZHP control arms, powerflex urethane bushings front and rear) I thought the car had a weird tendency to "twitch" in corners...The steering is showing feedback by slightly rocking back and forth at the limit of adhesion. I had always thought it was a problem with the NEROs. It wasn't. My front LCA bushings are almost completely shot. Imad, official SCTS Tribe mechanic friend, showed me how my bushings were torn and was leaking hydraulic fluid (the OEM bushings were filled with hydraulic fluid) and basically as I corner the control arm is allowed to move back and forth in the bushing carrier...Not good. It turns out these NEROs are in fact VERY GOOD and that my bushings has just been slowly deteriorating that I never noticed the degradation in handling.

The solid bushings are confidence inspiring in the corners. Now, if the steering is just a tad tighter I'd be in bliss, but I can't complain. There is significant increase in road noise, vibration transmitted through the chassis are now solid thunks instead. Oddly enough, I was expecting tramlining to worsen since the front LCAs don't have the same slot, but tramlining hasn't been an issue at all.

Again, I'd like to have tested the Motorsports II LCAs separately from the solid bushings, but it makes absolutely no sense not to replace them both at the same time.

Car is getting 2 more miles to a gallon since last week when I swapped out the old transmission fluid. Word to the wise...Keep the factory fluid in your car. The redline that came out of my transmission was a dark INKY black. The transmisison fluid that came out 30K miles ago, the OEM fluid that lasted 40K miles, didn't look nearly as bad.

[Plaz]

Word to the wise...Keep the factory fluid in your car. The redline that came out of my transmission was a dark INKY black. The transmisison fluid that came out 30K miles ago, the OEM fluid that lasted 40K miles, didn't look nearly as bad.

Interesting.

[Nick M3]

Word to the wise...Keep the factory fluid in your car. The redline that came out of my transmission was a dark INKY black. The transmisison fluid that came out 30K miles ago, the OEM fluid that lasted 40K miles, didn't look nearly as bad.

Interesting.

This dovetails with what I've observed. (As well as one other member who may or may not want to keep his identity hidden.)

[The HACK]

Word to the wise...Keep the factory fluid in your car. The redline that came out of my transmission was a dark INKY black. The transmisison fluid that came out 30K miles ago, the OEM fluid that lasted 40K miles, didn't look nearly as bad.

Interesting.

I'm beginning to wonder how bad my transmission fluid is. My fuel economy jumped up 2 mph from just switching it out. However, my fuel economy numbers after the change were CONSISTENT with the same setup using OEM fluid. The OBC reads about 27.6mpg average (24mpg at the pump) and now it's reading close to 29.7mpg average (26.7mpg at the pump, at current rate).

Looks to me like the Redline stuff needs to be changed out regularly. Like no more than every 30K miles.

[Mr Paddle.Shift]

I changed out mine as well. Yup, black, inky like liquid. Imad said it's still "good". Anyway, filled it up with Redline D4 ATF and now the transmission is so much more responsive. Can't believe BMW claims the fluid as lifetime.